Lost back country skier sues SAR for taking too long

[jbreen]

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2009/06/16/9811671-sun.html
While I feel for his loss, I think he is deflecting responsibility.

 

[dug]

It was due to happen eventually.

 

[Stash]

Throw him to the Union Leader posters!

 

[Hikes4fun]

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2009/06/16/9811671-sun.html
While I feel for his loss, I think he is deflecting responsibility.

I think you're being too kind.....

 

[hikes-with-him]

I think it is simply an example of a bigger problem in society as a whole...we want to do what we want to do when we want to do it and how we want to do it...with no one telling us anything about it...

BUT...when our actions cause us a problem...we refuse to see our own hand in this...and just point fingers at anyone else we can find. Unfortunately, this time, the finger pointing was towards men and women volunteering (i.e....no PAY!) to put their lives in danger to rescue those who (probably) could have avoided being in that situation if they had only been a little less...careless (maybe...don't throw anything please) or maybe who were just in the wrong place at the wrong time...

 

[Craig]

I have been following this story with some interest. It seems that the plaintiff has a pretty good case.

I’m wondering if this case will have any effect on how SAR conducts business here in the US.

I’m sure everyone involved in a search and rescue makes judgment decisions minute by minute during a rescue. If their decisions come under greater scrutiny or the risk of greater scrutiny by the legal community, will this effect how SAR makes decisions about our safety?

 

[WinterWarlock]

Craig -

This particular article doesn't say enough to seem like there's a real case...do you have more? In the meantime, the SAR has shut down...that hardly seems like a good outcome for the folks out there...

Scott

 

[deanmacg]

I think it is simply an example of a bigger problem in society as a whole...we want to do what we want to do when we want to do it and how we want to do it...with no one telling us anything about it...

An enlarged sense of entitlement coupled with a hair trigger sensitivity = spoiled rotten. Welcome to America.

 

[WinterWarlock]

Reading this, I may have to agree with Craig...(from this link)

RCMP admit mistake over lack of search

Meanwhile, the RCMP said Thursday that failing to start a search for the pair was a mistake.
Cpl. Dan Moskaluk said the RCMP made a mistake in not initiating a search on Feb 21. after an SOS was spotted in the snow. Cpl. Dan Moskaluk said the RCMP made a mistake in not initiating a search on Feb 21. after an SOS was spotted in the snow. (CBC)

"There was an error on behalf of the RCMP in not initiating a call-out on Feb. 21," Cpl. Dan Moskaluk said on Thursday morning in Golden, B.C.

Even though the couple got lost on Sunday, Feb. 15, a search for them didn't begin until nine days after they disappeared, despite sightings of SOS signs scratched into the snow. SOS signs were noticed on Feb. 17, and again on Feb. 21, which is when the RCMP were first informed.

 

[Craig]

Also, there was a communication/notification disconnect between the resort, dispatch, SARs in the communication chain. It was publicly acknowledged that this communication disconnect occurred.

At the time this occurred there was a lot of press from several different news sources. After piecing the details together I was left with the distinct impression that this was a slam dunk.

There should still be a plethora of news articles still floating around if you goggle.

 

[Stash]

I’m sure everyone involved in a search and rescue makes judgment decisions minute by minute during a rescue. If their decisions come under greater scrutiny or the risk of greater scrutiny by the legal community, will this effect how SAR makes decisions about our safety?

My thought is they would simply stop doing it. Of course then someone would sue them for not being there.

Second guessing has become a lucrative business and someone, not necessarily the lost skier/hiker, will find a way to profit from any decision that is or is not made. It's an unfortunate state that can only be resolved by people taking responsibility for their actions.

Having a "legal case" means simply meeting the criteria put in place by external parties. The rationale behind decisions will always (unfortunately) be up for review by “experts” who may have made the same decision at the same time but are fortunate in that they don’t have to.

 

[WinterWarlock]

There should still be a plethora of news articles still floating around if you goggle.

As in the above - once the RCMP publicly admits error, their case is sunk.

 

[Craig]

Having a "legal case" means simply meeting the criteria put in place by external parties. The rationale behind decisions will always (unfortunately) be up for review by “experts” who may have made the same decision at the same time but are fortunate in that they don’t have to.

Unfortunately, public policy is sometimes formed by legal liability with healthy portion of public opinion.

In this particular case, I was left with the impression that there would be a lot of public sympathy for this guy.

I’m no lawyer nor am I involved in the SAR community but I would have to think that folks here in the US are watching this case.

Probably best if hush money is paid and everyone moves on.

 

[Stash]

.

Probably best if hush money is paid and everyone moves on.

Take the money out of it and I have no issue with much of the litigation today. If it's about making things work better I'm all for it.

I just see too much of it about the money and "punishment" and not enough about honest attempts to learn.

 

[hikes-with-him]

Hmmmm....interesting info in the other article...

I wonder WHY the search was delayed? I am just thinking out loud here...if this orgainzation is staffed by volunteers...it probably doesn't get a lot of funding? Someone said...decision making...maybe they made the decision to wait based on the fact that they only have so much for resources available to them...and this couple are continually described as "athletic", "cold doesn't bother them", "know what they're doing". Maybe this info resulted in the decision to "delay"? I remember reading somewhere about a SARs rescue that was too early...and some felt "geesh, maybe they just wanted to be left alone for a while...they could have gotten out by themselves...wasted money searching too early when they could have done it themselves...".

Not judging...just thinking outloud. Sometimes, it seems no matter what is done...it was the wrong decision.

 

[Hobbitling]

An enlarged sense of entitlement coupled with a hair trigger sensitivity = spoiled rotten. Welcome to America.

ummm, this was in Canada. did you mean North America?

 

[Chip]

...and this couple are continually described as "athletic", "cold doesn't bother them", "know what they're doing". Maybe this info resulted in the decision to "delay"? .

I believe it does locally. When I had to call 911, and finally spoke to someone local, the discussion about whether I was prepared to spend the night occured. I don't remember if they brought it up or I did, though. When they (Franconia PD) spoke to my wife, she also reiterated I carry enough gear to be okay overnight.

Canada also has a Good Samaritan Law which is "a legal principle that prevents a rescuer who has voluntarily helped a victim in distress from being successfully sued for 'wrongdoing.' " But I don't know if it applies to organized, trained SAR groups. Hopefully it does.

... Sometimes, it seems no matter what is done...it was the wrong decision.

Agree. Especially if someone died.

 

[Chip]

Take the money out of it and I have no issue with much of the litigation today. If it's about making things work better I'm all for it.

I just see too much of it about the money and "punishment" and not enough about honest attempts to learn.

This has basically been said; but I think there needs to be an assumption of personal responsibility on the part of the lost/injured (they could have stayed in bed that day) and a rock-solid "hold harmless" law for ANY rescue attempt (the recuers could have stayed in bed that day too and not risked their own lives) or the whole SAR thing is doomed.

 

[Grumpy]

I think it is simply an example of a bigger problem in society as a whole...we want to do what we want to do when we want to do it and how we want to do it...with no one telling us anything about it...

An enlarged sense of entitlement coupled with a hair trigger sensitivity = spoiled rotten. Welcome to America.

Note that the story originated in Canada, not the USA.

G.

 

[Tom Rankin]

a rock-solid "hold harmless" law for ANY rescue attempt (the recuers could have stayed in bed that day too and not risked their own lives) or the whole SAR thing is doomed.

I almost agree with this, but SAR can make mistakes, or do something careless, that could lead to the person being worse off than if SAR had not been there.