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percious
09-13-2004, 02:05 PM
Has anyone whacked directly up Redfield from Cliff? I figured it might be a good route to follow Upper Twin Brook. Does anyone have recon. pics of the slides on cliff from Redfield?

-percious

percious
09-14-2004, 12:49 PM
Ok, no response. No bother, we will figure it out on the fly.

Has anyone stayed at the shelter on the very northern part of this map? (Road to Upper Works)

http://www.adirondackjourney.com/images/Upper_Works/uw_map3.gif

Is this still available? Is there parking at the trailhead?

-percious

Rick
09-14-2004, 01:09 PM
Percious,
the map doesn't really show it, but IIRC, that trail is a private trail and that shelter is on private land. The shelter may be more like (or less like) a huntung cabin.

I cannot recall who owns it, but I beleive it is the same party that closed the old trail to Santanonis. Whether it is NL industries or else paper company or private hunting club, I cannot recall)

Sorry I cannot be of much more help, but I am sure someone will ahve more info

Peakbagr
09-14-2004, 01:55 PM
There is no legal camping at the the UW. I concur that the camp you noted is on land leased by Finch Pruyn to the East River Rod and Gun Club. This is along the "old" route into Allen Mt before Finch-Pruyn and club members started complaining about hikers who were trespassing and doing things they shouldn't.
If you want to do both peaks, the proper thing is to probably to hike in to Uphill and base camp there or go from the Hanging Spear Falls area along the abandoned trail

percious
09-15-2004, 09:12 AM
Thanks for the info. Our plan right now is to either stay at a campsite, or sleep in our cars. We are going to be exploring Tahawus, then staying 2 nights at flowed lands, with Cliff, Redfield, and Skylight wedged in there. We may bushwhack directly up cliff from Flowed lands. Should be a challenge, given the reports of blowdown, but we never let 2 miles of pure bushwhacking deter us before.

-percious

Rick
09-15-2004, 09:50 AM
Percious,
FWIW, I have slept many times at the UW as well as the east river trailheads in my pickup truck with cap (and later back of my SUV) with no problems.

percious
09-15-2004, 10:18 AM
Yeah, a pretty good idea if you have a pickup. We will probably be taking my coupe up, which means 3 guys in a 2 door car. Not exactly the best sleeping conditions. At worst, I suppose we could set up a stealth campsite at one of the trailheads. We practice LNT, would be arriving late, and leaving early.... I kind of wanted to avoid this for moral reasons. Lake Harris is closed, but Long Lake looks to be open.

-percious

Peakbagr
09-15-2004, 11:23 AM
Percious,

Please note that I wasn't trying to be critical. In general, I have no problem with folks sleeping in cars at a trailheads. We all want to be good neighbors and stewarts of the mountains, however.

With the explosion of interest in the High Peaks, there are a handful of very busy trailheads. Folks who pull in late at nite wake up having to answer the call of nature. If even 1% of hikers using a trailhead use the woods in the immediate vicinity as a morning bathroom, it doesn't take a lot of imagination to conceive of what the surrounding woods will look like for the rest of us.

Peakbagr
09-15-2004, 12:34 PM
Tim,

Thanks for expressing my sentiments far better than I was able.
Just because there isn't a convenient campgroud or motel nearby a trailhead, doensn't give us license to use the trailhead as a bathroom.

mavs00
09-15-2004, 12:37 PM
Whoops, I accidently deleted it Alan, I'll try again

What I said was, please reconsider "stealth camping" near the UW trailhead. Like it or not, this is PRIVATE PROPERTY and it was not long ago that the land owners (who pay taxes on the land) were threatning casual (non-owner) hikers that were treating the land anyway they saw fit.

(I'm gonna get killed for this, but...) I appreciate your sentiments of LNT camping, but with all due respect, (IMO) LNT is only a goal It's not reasonable to expect to actually leave no trace (outside of winter). We must understand that whenever enter the forest, as either a dayhiker or camper (particularly a camper), we we will LST (leave some trace). Our goal should be to LALTAP (leave as little trace as possible). A stealth campsite is undoupbably going to LAHOAGT (leave a hell of a lot greater trace) then sleeping in car in a lot at the trailhead and, besides that it's tresspassing.

You understand this (I know from your "avoid this for moral reasons" comment), so this is actually aimed at the silent masses that may not be as morally grounded as you or I. Lot's of people read (but do not participate) here and I feel (my opinion only) that we owe it to this region, as a community, to advocate respecting rules and laws as they relate to our usage of public and private lands.

besides, there are 3 good pullouts along the road between Long Lake and Newcomb. They all are at least as cozy as the trailhead and within 25-30 minutes from the trailhead. Even if you had to use the trailhead to (sleep in your car) as I have (I CONFESS :(), that is a whole site more in keeping with LNT than pitching a tent in the woodline on private property.

btw, that's quite a trip you got planned, let us know how it goes. I'm to ascared of Cliff to bushwhack near her ever again :).

No disrespect intended in this post. I should NOTE that these are strictly my opinions, I speak soely for myself.

percious
09-16-2004, 09:45 AM
"I suppose we could set up a stealth campsite at one of the trailheads."

Probably not a good description of what we intend to do, if we use this option. The plan is more to set up a tent that you cannot see from the trailhead, nor the subsequent trail. We would cook breakfast back at the parking lot, where it will have little to no impact on the environment, or we will eat pop tarts. I am always the LNT Nazzi in the group, and try to leave a place in better shape then when we got there.

All that said. What do you mean by "pullouts" along Route 28A? Can we set up a tent at one of these? This would be the best option. We dont want to have to drive 20 miles to long lake.

-percious

Mavs, just out of curiosity, how far from the dax do you live?

Doc McPeak
09-16-2004, 11:24 AM
Originally posted by Peakbagr
Tim,

Thanks for expressing my sentiments far better than I was able.
Just because there isn't a convenient campgroud or motel nearby a trailhead, doensn't give us license to use the trailhead as a bathroom.

There are privies at the Allen and Adirondac trailheads, which I think is a very prudent idea for the exact reason of the nearest bathroom being 25 miles away. Most trailheads in the Northeast have porta-potties or real bathrooms (the Whites) for this reason. Part convenience for the hikers, part pro-active maintenence. Human waste is a much greater danger than mere garbage, not that either is acceptable ... anywhere.

masshysteria
09-16-2004, 09:52 PM
Percious, I don't know if you could set a tent up at the pulloffs on Rt 28N that Tim mentioned. But you never know, it might be O.K. I will admit that this summer, my son and I set up a tent in the parking lot of the NP trailhead on 28 between Long Lake and Newcomb. We didn't get out of the woods from climbing Seymour until 9:00, so by the time we ate, it was 11:00, and we were beat. We set it up off to the side, and there was even a privy there. No one bothered us, and we were out of there by 7:30 the next morning. We were origionally going to sleep under the tonneau cover of my truck, but my son wasn't comfortable with that.