Legal to Bike up Moosilauke?

On another BBS, I saw some chatter about taking mountain bikes up the Carriage Road on Moosilauke. Is this legal? I know you can take a snowmachine up to the turn-around during winter but I've never been to the lower part of the trail to see if there's a warning etc.

I know at the Lodge, there is this sign: http://community.webshots.com/photo/546723764/2800479820064090481aHrCMP with the Model T comment presumably because I recall reading that someone drove a car up once. I wouldn't take my ferrari on that trail though! No sirreee!!

-Dr. Wu

I can't believe that I got to this post before Dave, but there is no biking allowed on the Carriage Road. It is on private land and it is posted no biking. You can refer to this thread for more information:

http://www.vftt.org/forums/showthread.php?t=3763

(BTW - I believe that by the time I hit Sumbit Reply, I'll see Dave's post there already. Here goes.)

Hey, I've got work to do!

Chomp is correct, bikes are not allowed on the Carriage Road once it goes onto Dartmouth land. This is at the Camp Misery Bridge, which is very low down on the mountain. The other thread covers more details.

-dave-

David Metsky said:

Hey, I've got work to do!

Chomp is correct, bikes are not allowed on the Carriage Road once it goes onto Dartmouth land. This is at the Camp Misery Bridge, which is very low down on the mountain. The other thread covers more details.

-dave-

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Ah, but the other thread asks about "Downhill" biking on Moosilauke. I'm asking about "Uphill" -- big difference!

Much like people on snowmachines occasionally go all the way to the summit, I'm sure legal or not people bike it. I won't, don't worry -- my bike would fall apart anyway. I already said I wouldn't drive up in my Ferrari and I promise I won't go up in my Lamborghini or Bentley either.

-Dr. Wu

I once saw someone go up the road on a four wheeler, two four wheelers actually. They were taking the fire/rescue crew to a girl who was having an asthma attack between the Main and South summits.

It didn't look like a ride I'd like to take anytime soon. The guy on the was getting bounced around like a rag doll. I wondered how he stayed on.

I'll keep traveling on the boots. It's a lot safer and saner.

Solution: Segway!

GlennS said:

I'll keep traveling on the boots. It's a lot safer and saner.

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Maybe a Segway would work better for you. Slower, safer and you'd look wicked cool riding the trail on one!!

-Dr. Wu

That might work. I'm willing to bet there's no "No Segway" signs.

dr_wu002 said:

Ah, but the other thread asks about "Downhill" biking on Moosilauke. I'm asking about "Uphill" -- big difference!

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No bikes, up or down. I see tracks occasionally, but it doesn't happen that often. There's a summit steward up top all summer who would certainly read the riot act to anyone he/she spots on a bike. I've stopped bikers and told them to turn around and head down and they usually comply.

It hasn't turned out to be a major concern, but if anyone asks, please tell them that bikes aren't allowed.

-dave-

David Metsky said:

It hasn't turned out to be a major concern, but if anyone asks, please tell them that bikes aren't allowed.

-dave-

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I'm going to assume this precludes skateboarding as well.

You never know what these durn kids are gonna try these days...



-Dr. Wu

Skateboard??? Nah.....ATB...All Terrain Board...



Now even I have my limits. Don't think I'll be hoping on one of those.

- darren

Well, whoever that guy is, tell him he better shut his mouth, lest he start injesting pine cones, small rodents, kids....

I've seen those mountain boards on STP for sale. I'd like the wheels for it, thinking they would be kind of rugged and cool for a off-road kayak carrier. I made a kayak carrier out of 20" BMX wheels for use off-road but they are tall in a way...

Jay

Too bad.

More trails should be open to bikers. I think the two activities can share most trails just fine.

catskillclimber said:

More trails should be open to bikers. I think the two activities can share most trails just fine.

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Sorry, but I really believe most trails cannot be share by hikers and bikers. Anyway, I might be wrong on this one, but I think mountain bikes are eroding trails much more faster, if not they certainly make them more muddy, right?


I remember hiking with our 3 years old daughter, and some bikers (and not the stereotyped-extrem-guy, just some regular men) were using the same trail. While going up, they passed us so fast my daughter started to cry. I think they warned us, but we didn't have the time to pull aside. When they came down, they almost got us.

timmus said:

Sorry, but I really believe most trails cannot be share by hikers and bikers.

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Even as a part-time biker, I have to agree that you have a point.

I'm all for restricting mountain bikes to specific trails and jeep roads.

I rarely see people when I'm trail riding, but when I do, I slow down to walking speed and shuffle along scooter style. With horses, I get off and let them pass. I feel that it's just to dangerous to do otherwise. Perhaps I'm overly cautious. But I still managed to spook a dog once on a fire road (I think the screech from the brakes scared it).

Unfortunately, it has been my personal observation that most mountain bikers don't slow down much, if any. Especially if they are in a group.

ATVs on the other hand...

timmus said:

Sorry, but I really believe most trails cannot be share by hikers and bikers. Anyway, I might be wrong on this one, but I think mountain bikes are eroding trails much more faster, if not they certainly make them more muddy, right?

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Hikers and bikers can exist very happily on the same trails - this attitude is fairly unique to the northeast. Go out west, and they allow mountain bikes on just about every single hiking trail outside of the wilderness. And it is not a problem. I have mountain biked along a busy section of the CDT and always met hikers with a smile (from me and from them).

Even states like Pennsylvania and Virginia encourage mountain biking. While bikes are banned from the AT, in Virginia hundrends of miles of trails in the George Washington National Forest are biker friendly. PA has several "destination" locations for mountain biking. A good friend of mine is head of the parks service for Delaware and just about all of the trails that he builds and maintains are multi-use.

While there are obvious limitations (as in trying to mtn bike up the Lions Head Trail) and restrictions (wilderness, steep trail that are prone to erosion, etc), bikers and hikers can live together.

chomp said:

While there are obvious limitations (as in trying to mtn bike up the Lions Head Trail) and restrictions (wilderness, steep trail that are prone to erosion, etc), bikers and hikers can live together.

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This is a topic that has been of debate for a long time. I can honestly say IMO that being both a Hiker and a Mt. Biker here in the MWV that this has been an ongoing issue that has moved in a positive direction.
As Chomp has already mentioned there are obvious limitations, but the problem is that there are also some not so obvious limitations. What might seem Mt. bikable to one rider might not be to another; but beyond that at least in this area some very good regulations have been instituted for Mt. Biking as is there for hiking. Unfortunately like many activities the users are not aware of or seek to be aware of the regulations that are in place for the common good. Users of the Outdoors in what ever medium they choose to use should educate themselves on the local R&R, which is what most folks do. Again unfortunately like many activities there are always a few who don't educate themselves therefore ruining it for the masses.
Mt. Biking has a way to go in the education field to catch up to hiking. Both can coexist with effort from both parties. Right now in this area a nice balance is developing between three areas: 1. Hiking only trails 2.Biking only trails. 3. Hiking and biking trails The difficult part as I already mentioned is educating outdoor users what areas are legal to use for which of the three above mentioned categories. IMO the burden begins with the user to educate him/herself with the R & R of a particular area, although the community of users also have a responsibilty to educate among and beyond themeselves.

Having seen way to many heated discussions than I care to count, and like many people here, I am both a mountain biker and a hiker, although lately, ever since I've taken up commuting to work by bike, usually my weekends are spent off the bike, i.e. hiking or kayaking so as such, my mountain biking has been very lax lately.

But maybe I'm strange, as a hiker, I've never had any bad encounters with mtn bikers in NJ and vice versa, maybe perhaps because I am aware that there are bikers out there as a hiker, and as a biker, I'm aware that there are hikers and equestrians using the trails. So what do I do? I listen and am aware of my distance I can see and expect to be in control. Just like driving my car on the interstate, you don't drive/ski/hike/bike faster than the conditions allow.

There is a place for everything in this world, ATVs, Snowmachines, power boats, included, exclusionary tactics just results in pissed off bikers/hikers/skiers!

I live in NJ, which is a huge warground for the hikers vrs bikers topic, being a highly dense area (in general) and having a lot of small parks, there is always conflict amoung the various groups... I don't see any more damage from mountain biking than the more popular hiking trails, I mean I see rutted trails on the top of mountains in the ADKs from hikers, I see rutted trails on biking trails in NJ, although bike tracks are infinitely more noticeable than hiking boots which is one part of the problem with the perception of biking, it's more noticeable because of the track a bike tire leaves versus the hundreds of hiker tracks in the same area, but the damage is done by both.

Jay

I am both a biker and a hiker. The mountian biking only trails that I have been on are in much better shape than many of the hiking only trails I've been on. In my area, the bikers take very good care of " their" trails. Bikers are more apt to plow right thru mud and, of course, jump over obstacles (we don't leave until we bleed attitude) whereas hikers often go around these things and widen the trail, contributing to more mud etc. Just my observations.

bike commuting

Jay H said:

Having seen way to many heated discussions than I care to count, and like many people here, I am both a mountain biker and a hiker, although lately, ever since I've taken up commuting to work by bike, usually my weekends are spent off the bike, i.e. hiking or kayaking so as such, my mountain biking has been very lax lately.

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Definitely heated.

Not to hijack a thread, but I'm impressed with anyone who commutes to work. I did it for a few seasons, thirty miles round trip. I loved the exercise. But the cars were killer (almost literally). After getting honked at, cut off, and almost hit for the n-th time by drivers using cell phones or just not paying attention, I decided the bike commute was just too risky. And to think I live on a route touted in at least one NH bike trip books.

That sinking feeling that the fly feels as the windshield approaches (apologies to N Peart) may just be something like what non-mountain bikers feel when a bike goes careening past.

jrichard said:

Not to hijack a thread, but I'm impressed with anyone who commutes to work. I did it for a few seasons, thirty miles round trip. I loved the exercise. But the cars were killer (almost literally).

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I've got a 20-mile round trip, but with the exception of the first two miles by my apartment, and the second-to-last one approaching my office, I'm lucky enough to be able to take a combination of back roads and 5 different bike trails to otherwise completely avoid traffic. For all the urbanness surrounding me, it's great to have enough bits of conservation land to connect the dots and be able to do that.

If it was all major roads each way, I doubt I'd do it.