Crampons in mixed terrain?

Around this time of the year, the lower parts of many trails are mostly, but not fully melted out. It would be nice if the snow and ice stopped at exactly one place and then I would take my crampons off at that spot. Unfortunately, it does not work that way. Trails often have snowy, icy areas below areas that are bare rock.

So my question is: how do you balance out the need for stablity with the need to protect your crampons by not using them on too many rocks? How many contiuous feet on rock justifies removing the crampons in order to protect them even though you will likely have to then take the time to be putting them on and off several times on the descent?

Thunder Dan said:

Around this time of the year, the lower parts of many trails are mostly, but not fully melted out. It would be nice if the snow and ice stopped at exactly one place and then I would take my crampons off at that spot. Unfortunately, it does not work that way. Trails often have snowy, icy areas below areas that are bare rock.

So my question is: how do you balance out the need for stablity with the need to protect your crampons by not using them on too many rocks? How many contiuous feet on rock justifies removing the crampons in order to protect them even though you will likely have to then take the time to be putting them on and off several times on the descent?

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Answer: Stabilicers!
They also help keep your boots up out of the slush and mud a little.

Of course; You may still need full crampons or snowshoes in places...

i agree with nh mtn with one addendum or caveat if you will--yaktrax (patent pending, trademark R, etc) in my opinion are better than stabilicers--(but it's six o' one, half dozen o' t'other really). having said that though, go ahead and wear yer 'pons!! that's what they're for! so ya dull 'em a little? just sharpen those bad boys up with a bastard file. that'll do the trick. and even though it makes a bit of a racket, spikes stick good to bare rock--they even have a name for it--"dry toolin'". but ya'll prolly knew that!

ps--another thing about spikes is that chicks dig 'em! you'll have that whole mountain man hardguy thing goin' on if ya rock the full on 'pons!

Welcome to the shoulder seasons...

Its a judgement call for when to put crampons on and off.

On rock, just place all points (flat foot) as gently as possible. And expect to have to resharpen occasionally.

Others have mentioned yaktrax and stabilicers. Also consider instep or 6pt crampons.

Aluminum crampons don't do well on rock--steel will last much longer.

Doug

Stablicers

Stablicers get my vote. I've used these successfully on mixed terrain. Although I'm less enthusastic about donning these for ong ice flows. I'd rather have crampons on.

Having said that, wearing crampons on mixed terrain esp in spring is like driving a tractor with wobbly metal tires down a boulder field. It just isn't a pleasant experience on the ankles, etc. This past winter was rife with these experiences. Give me packed snow or contiguous ice any day!

I've heard other people rave about Yaks Traks, but I can't offer an opinion either way - unfortunately, I haven't tried them.

Good luck!

LTH

dont worry about your crampons worry about yourself falling, really. I am not a fan of stabalizers or yak trax whatever.

I just wear mine across the rocks and only have to sharpen them once a year. They'll take a lot of abuse, more than most people think. I do have stabilicers and Yax for the early fall and late summer, when there isn't enough ice for crampons, but otherwise leave them hanging on the wall in the mud room.

sierra said:

dont worry about your crampons worry about yourself falling, really.

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oh yeah! last december I was descending Cranberry Peak in ME when I slipped on ice and cracked a rib... 4 steps after I removed my crampons! The trail was a mix of ice & rock. I was concerned about damaging my crampons, it looked like more rock than ice.

Onestep

NH_Mtn_Hiker said:

Answer: Stabilicers!
They also help keep your boots up out of the slush and mud a little.

Of course; You may still need full crampons or snowshoes in places...

Click to expand...

I am a big stabilicers fan for the shoulder season. I was about to buy yaxtrax from my local EMS but I was dissuaded by a salesperson who has steered me well before. He felt that the mixed rock and ice would tear up the rubber on the yaxtrax if used in the dax (Dr. Seuss I'm not!). I was advised to get the stabilicers and I've been very happy with my decision. As for the type of terrain - I've climbed Algonquin in November when the half inch thick layer of ice made crampons overkill and had no problems. True they won't front point vertical ice but they enhance footing substantially on a variety of icy and snowy surfaces. I often use them for the descent when I was able to bareboot up and was sliding on the way down. They are on and off much quicker than crampons. If you destroy the little studs on the screws they are replaceable.

I'm concerned about turning an ankle while wearing crampons when I'm on ice. Obviously, this isn't a problem when wearing ice climbing plastic boots, but those things are just a bit heavy and absolutely no fun to hike in unless there is snow and ice everywhere.

Crampons on mixed trails also really chew up any soft spots in the trail (moss, mud, soft dirt).

In the fall, you seek out the bare spots of rock and avoid the snow and ice on the trail. In the spring, you seek out the snow and ice and avoid the bare spots of rock on the trail to avoid wearing down your crampons.

I just wear my crampons and sharpen them as needed. It seems every time I take them off thinking the trail is finally clear of ice, there is another ice flow just around the bend.

Stabilicers vs Yak Trax

Thank you for all the advice and comments on this subject.

For those of you who have recommended Yak Trax or stabilicers, what is the difference between them and which is better for you and why?

When I went to get them, several people told me that StabilIcers were better- I think because they lasted longer.

All I can say is, StabilIcers have worked GREAT for me on level ice, and semi-sloping ice, but they do definitely have their limitations on steep, hard ice; that's where you still need crampons.

I've used both stabilicers and Yaks a lot (I own two pair of both). The Yaks certainly improve traction but tend to slip/skate on hard ice. They also don't stay inplace as well and they are fragile. The one positive to Yaks is they are light...I tend to carry them Fall and late Spring when just a little traction may be needed. I really love the stabilicers. They stay on the boots with no need of adjustment. They bite well into ice and have great traction on wet rock as well..very useful for stream crossings. They are terrific for mixed routes. I have often used them when ascending even on water ice that is not too steep and they provide great traction (on descents I use crampons). Stabilicers have reduced my use of crampons significantly. I am a big, big fan of them. The only down side of stabilicers is that they involve significant additional weight....but they are worth it.