Anyone tried the Plastic Mountaineering Boot/A.T. Bindings thing ?

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Chip

Chip

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I know it's been discussed before, but that Atomic Rainier thread (55 BUCKS ??? :eek: ) got me thinking again. Let's say I get those skiis, mount Naxo N01 bindings and use my Koflach Degre's. I think that'd be great for light overnights on the rolling trails around here, like the AT in NY, CT & MA. I'd take them off and hike, regardless, if the terrain was too steep. My days of 40mph crashes in the woods are over. What am I missing ?
 
Chip said:
Let's say I get those skiis, mount Naxo N01 bindings and use my Koflach Degre's.
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Make sure the Degre's will fit the Naxo bindings. As I understand it, AT boots hike better than Tele boots, but hiking boots don't ski particularly well and may not fit in the bindings.

I think that'd be great for light overnights on the rolling trails around here, like the AT in NY, CT & MA. I'd take them off and hike, regardless, if the terrain was too steep. My days of 40mph crashes in the woods are over. What am I missing ?
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AT bindings are basically designed for 2 modes: walk (loose heel) and ski (locked heel). They don't kick and glide well--the pivot point is too far in front of the foot and the pivot is not designed to withstand the stresses of skiing unless your heel is locked.

When I XC or BC Tele ski, I can kick-and-glide efficiently and if a descent is too steep or difficult for me, I have no reservations about taking the skis off and walking down.

My guess is that you wouldn't be happy with the combo. (But put heavy duty XC boots and bindings or light duty Tele boots and bindings on and it sounds nice...)

Doug
 
Depending upon what you are planning to do, you might want to look into light AT boots. Last year I expanded my ski bin to include a pair of AT skis w/ diamir bindings & lowa struktura boots specifically to be able to "multi-task". In addition to skiing better than plastic hiking boots, the lowas were quite satisfactory for hiking (Nippletop) & were great for ice-climbing (cascade pass).
 
I have a set of Silvretta 404's mounted on some backcountry skis (Tua's) that I use with my plastic mountaineering boots (Scarpa Invernos) and they work OK for a combo type of setup. This setup is more weighted towards using the alpine mountaineering, but the skis do work OK. Wouldn't want to do any tricky stuff ski-wise as a mountaineering boot isn't designed as a ski boot and you don't have the same level of support hence less edge control. There's no perfect all-around setup for everything, but - it's a good compromise, especially when you want to climb (or maybe skin up) but mostly ski down.

Methinks your Koflach Degre's would work in much the same manner.
 
Kevin Rooney said:
I have a set of Silvretta 404's mounted on some backcountry skis (Tua's) that I use with my plastic mountaineering boots (Scarpa Invernos) and they work OK for a combo type of setup. This setup is more weighted towards using the alpine mountaineering, but the skis do work OK. Wouldn't want to do any tricky stuff ski-wise as a mountaineering boot isn't designed as a ski boot and you don't have the same level of support hence less edge control. There's no perfect all-around setup for everything, but - it's a good compromise, especially when you want to climb (or maybe skin up) but mostly ski down.

Methinks your Koflach Degre's would work in much the same manner.
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thanks, sounds good, I know nothing's perfect, and I'd be using the skis like fast snow shoes, not too demanding on the ankles, no real worries about release.
 
The discussion and design for a better Mousetrap has been going on for years.
If you are using a double cambered ski (touring) like you are looking at, mount the AT binding's pivot point on the balance point of the ski, and use a mountaineering boot you can get decent performance for utilitarian purposes. It is not ideal but will serve well for a mode of transport for approaches on flat and rolling terrain.An example might be the Wilderness Trail to the beginning of Bondcliff Trail or South Meadows to Marcy Dam.This secnario is often used to avoid having to wear/carry two pairs of boots and is usually a ski to ultimately climb situation. What you will be missing is great turning ability. The ski you are looking at is not meant for heel locked down skiing nor is the boot ideally. Also because of the design of the binding and the stiffness of the boot it is difficult to pressure the ski to turn in freeheel mode. If you were talking about a single cambered ski(alpine/norpine) with the heel locked down and you are a GOOD skier you can get decent downhill turning performance using a moutaineering boot. This setup is often used in big mountain approaches like the West Buttress of Denali where one is ferrying loads on esentially all up and then all down moderate terrain.Chip the setup you are thinking about using is applicable for certain situations as I mentioned above but not ideal for all situations...just like certain Mousetraps.
 
I bought a set of the ebay ones. I have been looking for something like this forever to retro-fit to my Snowshoes. I'll let you know how they work with my Tubbs. :)

-percious
 
percious said:
Any idea if the ebay AT bindings are going to work well with my La Sportiva Lotse's?
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if the lhotse's accept a toe bail crampon, which they do then they should fit.
 
I used to ski with Degres and Silvretta 504s. The combo stunk. Plain and simple. As others have said, it was fine for utilitarian purposes but wasn't much fun.

I finally gave up and hawked my 504s on ebay for most of what I paid for them.

Don't underestimate the perfectly good hiking capability of a 75mm toe. That'll give you the flexibility of some great backcountry setups or a full tele rig.

spencer
 
spencer said:
Don't underestimate the perfectly good hiking capability of a 75mm toe. That'll give you the flexibility of some great backcountry setups or a full tele rig.
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75 mm boots, particularly leather, can be very easy to walk in. A friend has used hers by choice on a snowshoe hike. The problem comes when you want to do steeper stuff--it is hard to kick steps with the flexible duckbill out front. Also hard to fit crampons.

Doug
 
DougPaul said:
The problem comes when you want to do steeper stuff--it is hard to kick steps with the flexible duckbill out front. Also hard to fit crampons.
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I disagree. I've found it surprisingly easy to kick steps up steeps with a duckbill. Also, many crampons are now available in wide configurations. I also customized my own crampons a few years back to accommodate the duckbill, before I knew of any commercially available.
 
spencer said:
I disagree. I've found it surprisingly easy to kick steps up steeps with a duckbill.
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Depends on how hard and steep the snow/ice is. One of the purported advantages of AT boots over Tele boots is that they are better for steep climbing.

Re crampons: I should have said "harder to fit".

Doug
 
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Okay, I searched "wide waxless touring ski" and found Atomic Chugach, and then Alaska Mountaineering & Hiking recommending "their" Atomic Chugach's and Silvretta 500 LSV's for exactly what I'm talking about.
They also discuss this combo in a discussion of "Snowshoes vs Skis".
So we're obviously not the only ones thinking some combo like this should work and maybe even work pretty well.
 
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