Winter boots

I'm pretty sure that Alpinista and AMSTony have converted me into a winter hiker. I've read threads here and see that not all winter hikers wear plastics. I tried on a pair of Columbia Bugabootoo's today and found them to be super comfortable. Does anyone here hike in them? Any comments? I'm not sure I want to spring for plastics just yet. Thanks.

Plastic boots are heavy and expensive. But they work great for step-in crampons, lots of above-treeline travel, kicking steps & ice climbing.

If you are new to winter hiking, you're probably a long way from needing them now, and there are many lighter and inexpensive alternatives for 98% of the hiking we do here in the northeast.

I have a pair of One Sport Massif's (insulated leather boots) and I love them. They are made to accept step in crampons and they work great. I have never tried plastic but I suspect when my One Sport's wear out I will at least try them.

Keith

Bugabootoo's
I bought a pair of Bugabootoo's a few years ago as my first pair of winter peakbagging/hiking boots. They are very comfortable on shorter hikes, especially flat-land hikes. They're also comfortable in my snowshoes. They're very waterproof (even goretex can't compare) and are my favorite boots in the early spring when the trails start getting messy.

However; As far as a winter hiking boot, especially in temps below 0F and/or on rocky or icy terrain, they're terrible. First of all, like many of Columbia's rubber bottomed boots as well as similar ones by North Face and other companies, they only have 200 grams of insulation. This is fine for 20+ deg. days, but when you're on Mt. Adams at -10F and the winds are gusting to 40mph (a gentle breeze in winter ) you'll likely want a warmer pair of boots on your feet. Another problem is the lack of support (shank) in the bottom of the boot. This is one of the things that makes them so comfortable in the store, but on a rocky trail or worse, with crampons strapped on, they'll leave your feet all achey breaky by the end of the hike.

Plastic boots
If you're going to go climb some 14 k'ers out west or climb some vertical ice or maybe do a bunch of winter camping then by all means try the plastic boots. If however, your hiking is going be be mostly peakbagging and snowshoeing in New England then I think plastic's are totally unnecessary.

Leather boots
Between the rubber bottomed boots and the pastics are the leather boots. While not quite as waterproof as the rubber and plastic boots they're generally more suited to New England winter hiking that either of the others. There are hundreds of models of insulated leather boots avialable with up to 1000 grams of Thinsulate ultra. Many of them are available in waterproof leather and/or goretex or the generic equivalent. With leather boots you can also choose the level of rigidity you want. I've found that my leather boots are much more comfortable on the moderate or longer hikes, especially if there is rock-hopping or cramponing involved. The leather boots are also usually resoleable, I don't believe the rubber boots are. In addition, leather boots will protect your feet better than rubber boots and they won't be all covered with scratches when you return from a snowless hike atop the Presidentials.

FWIW: As others who've led group hikes in the winter can attest, one of the most common reasons people bail on a winter hike is because they have inadequate footwear...on the group hikes I've been on, all too often rubber bottomed boots with only 200 grams of insulation are involved.....but, your mileage may vary.

For those considering new leather boots, you may want to consider the Rocky Sport Utility Pro and the Lynx.

Oh, and those comfort ratings like -20 and -65, don't pay much attention to those. They're useful for comparisons only. With only a 200 gram boot your feet would be ready to desert you after just 15 minutes or so of inactivity at -20F.

We hike in both Plastic boots and Columbia Ice Dragons They both keep our feet equally warm. The plastic boots are great for stepin crampons, are completely waterproof, and have removable liners for an overnight. Columbia boots are much more comfortable on long walks such as the Wilderness trail or Livermore Rd.

If you are just starting out check out Columbia Ice Dragons or the North Face equivialnt - be sure to try them both on as the fit differantly.

sorel style rubber bottom boots

sorels used to be somewhat of the 'standard', they were bought by columbia and still carry the sorel label. They are a little thicker rubber boot with a half inch or so of wool felt in them. At the beans in concord, they have 89 dollar sorel lookalikes on sale for 49 bucks. they are rated to '-80' or something..whatever that means. I use them and i put a 'made for the boot wool insert' you can buy, inside the boot. It goes on the bottom and adds support to the bottom of the boot. These boots are a little heavy but sure are warm. You can put instep crampons on them, or I use the black diamond ones I got at ems, I think a 'one size fits all' crampon they have. The particular crampon is made to fit over a non plastic boot. Just another idea.

This will be the third winter, in addition to climbing Mount Whitney and Shasta, that I've hiked in the Columbia Bugabootoos. My feet have only ever been cold once in all that time (at the top of Garfield in sub-zero temps) and they have never ached, been sore, etc. despite extensive crampon/snowshoe/Stabilicer use. I do have plastics but the Bugaboottoos are far lighter and easier on the knees.

Plastics are great (I'm lucky that the pair I have fit perfectly and don't give me shin bang, etc) and very useful for winter camping or being stuck in extreme cold conditions but the Bugataboos are far more comfortable and, all things being equal, I would reach for them first every time I go winter hiking.

In serious winter I've used everything from Sorel pacs to heavy leather Limmers to plastics (Koflach ice climbing boots). All were adequate for below and above treeline, but to me the plastics are by far the best. Great insulation and warmth, take step-in crampons well, excellent for kicking steps. Besides, you look like a real mountaineer in them!

I prefer the leather boots for snowshoes, though, and in the boggy low flatlands the Sorels are still my favorites. Both of these types of walking require more flexibility than the plastics allow. I don't have a problem with the stiffness of the plastics on hikes that will involve steep terrain, although I know some people really don't like that. Who knows, maybe I'm just easy to please.

If you are plan to winter camp. double boots are the way to go, you can bring the liners in your bag to keep warm. Sorels okay if mostly snowshoeing, I'd recommend plastics if mostly above treeline & in crampons.

The softer boots are usually very flexible making them good for walking & less than ideal for crampons. Crampons will work with them for a couple or few years but people do on occasion break the spacer bar, usally not at their car either.

I have a pair of plastics & a pair of leather mountaineering boots (EMS Arete's) the Arete's are pretty good but on most winter days I prefer plastics. If my trip was to go longer than expected (like overnight) I'd want the extra protection. The lighter boots seem to work well for people who don't get caught in an unexpected bivy.

Winter Foot Wear

I have both leather and plastic boots and from my own experiences I have found that leather works great for me in all seasons.

I find plastic boots just a mite too stiff and heavy to hike the long distances and they are hard on my shins. But, on the other hand the convenience of step in crampons and snowshoes is another thing.

After some experimentation I now wear the same pair of all leather boots that I use in the summer for my winter trips. But then, my feet don't sweat much and the cold doesn't really bother them much.

One thing to keep in mind is that in the winter, any moisture is turned into a solid. So boots that get wet, or even damp, from say- sweating feet, snow that melts on warm boots as you wear them or dipping them into a stream, can freeze solid when you take them off- if backpacking. (A bottle of hot water thrust into the boots in the morning will thaw them out and your body heat when you wear them will keep them pliable).

It's really a matter of finding out what works for you and your activities.

I picked up a pair of Columbia Ice Crushers (the same as the Ice Dragons mentioned by BobandGeri only not rated to as low a temp) and have not had any complaints. My feet feel great on long or short hikes, I wore them rock hopping on Jefferson in winter and long more level approaching in places like 19 mile brook trail. No complaints. I have yet to wear them in sub-zero temps, but am pretty sure they will still do just fine as long as I keep moving and dont sit down for too long (which is not likely to happen much in winter anyways.)

One thing about plastics that Ive heard........you need to be careful with snowshoes. Plastic boots will shred some snowshoe decking reaaaal good.

Brian

Thumbs up for Columbia's Ice Crushers, Ice Dragons, and Ice Fields. These are much more boot than the Bugabootoo's. I have a pair of Ice Fields myself.

I've read that many of the plastic liner boots require upgraded liners because the stock liners don't do a very good job of keeping the feetsies warm.
Perhaps someone who uses Plastic liner boots regularly could comment on how often the liners have to be replaced and how much they cost. $$$

My winter boot line-up.

These boots are recommended by Will Steger (Arctic Explorer).
http://www.mukluks.com/yukon.shtml

I am still wearing the Sorel Bear boot, insulated to minus 40, and will accomodate crampons. My feet have never been cold.
If I could affford the Mukluks, I would get the Yukons.

This is an interesting thread. I'm trying to make up my mind on a boot for the transitional season.
For much of the year, I use lightweight, ankle-highs like Hi-Techs. With the amount of off trail hiking they see, they get trashed after a year or less.
As the temps drop, its not cold enough for me to go to my heavy Limmers, and way too early for the deepfreeze Sorels.

I was out last weekend in light snow and wet, and I had the lightweight Hi-Techs on and my feet were soaked all day. After reading this thread, I went to EMS this morning and picked up a pair of their store brand "Twin Mt" goretex hikers. Just slightly more substantial than my summer weights, and with a rubber bottom and 'leather' upper in place of cloth.
They are better than what I was wearing last weekend, but as the temps continue to drop, and snow builds up, was looking for something with some insulation value. What they had were much taller, warmer, but heavier.
They didn't have the Ice Dragons, and the salesperson told me that the North Face equivalent of the Ice Dragons was a wear-around-town winter boot, suitable for only light trail or bushwhacking.
I'm still looking around, but would prefer not to purchase online without trying them out.

Alan

I too find this thread interesting. If you ask 10 people an opinion about winter boots, you'll get 10 different answers. Ranging from "Just wear my plain summer boots, and cheap crampons" to "Must have high-end double plastic boots and 12-point high-end step in crampons and an ice axe." As always, the truth is somewhere in the middle. I may have to rent stuff (suggestions for where -- EMS in Conway is the only place I know of, except REI in Reading, where there isn't any place to hike ;-) ) Other ideas?

Tim

I have Ice Dragons, and Bugabootoo's. I have found them to be very warm and comfortable for hiking, snowshoes and crampons down to about 0 deg F. Haven't been out with them in colder weather yet. For the price, you can't go wrong. I

Bobby -

If you go for the Bugabootoos or Ice Dragons, be sure to use something to preserve their waterproofing. I learned the hard way. I never greased my Ice Dragons and on about my 10th hike, they wet out on a mild winter day in deep snow. Wasn't fun

That being said, I find them to be fairly comfortable and very warm. I like my Merrell Winterras a bit better, but I don't think they don't make them anymore.

Marty

Thanks for the ideas, I know we all have our preferences. Like most, I'm not willing to drop a lot of $$ only to find that winter in the woods is not for me. At least with waterproof leathers, if I'm not a winter hiker, I can wear the boots around town. Try that with bright orange Koflach's!

Peakbagr said:

This is an interesting thread. I'm trying to make up my mind on a boot for the transitional season.

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I call now the transitional season, and I find my Limmers perfect for it. Last Sunday on a Twins-Galehead loop I tried
to get my feet wet a couple times on stream crossings. The high, well greased boots and good winter gaiters kept me dry.

As others have said, this is an extremely individual issue. That's why so many of our posts feature the word "I" quite a bit.

Bobby said:

Thanks for the ideas, I know we all have our preferences. Like most, I'm not willing to drop a lot of $$ only to find that winter in the woods is not for me. At least with waterproof leathers, if I'm not a winter hiker, I can wear the boots around town. Try that with bright orange Koflach's!

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You might try renting. If you go out with inadequate boots, you risk frostbite and possible permanent damage.

Doug