New thread on winter boots

I've never had any problems in leather as long as I could keep moving. However, some of the mountaineering courses I've looked into require plastics and after a couple tries I now have Degre's. They are more comfortable than I thought they would be, so why wouldn't I wear them in winter ? There seems to be a little backlash type prejudice against plastics here. They are just tools, like anything. If they might keep you more comfortable/dry/warm/whatever, I'd at least give them a try.

I think anyone who hikes in winter without plastic double boots is nuts.

Sincerely,

John Smith
President & CEO of Koflach

MissionsMan said:

Fit is it.

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Amen. In winter I wear single-layer leather workboots, no insulation at all (except for socks, plus an air gap because the boots fit loosely). No problem winter camping, winter hiking above treeline, falling into streams in winter, etc etc. Generally my feet end up wet - from sweat. I don't keep my boots inside my bag or even inside the tent. (No need, there's nothing water-absorbent in the boot.) If the boots have gotten very wet, I make sure I leave them wide open in case they stiffen up overnight. That's all, except that I wax the boots and laces a few times a season.

I hope someone who is not experienced does not read the following and presume it is good advice - it is from my personal experience and not to be followed under ANY circumstances!!!

"Back in the day", i wore "large plastic bags" (AKA bread bags ) inside my "snowmobile" or sorel-type boots (actually, Lacrosse brand equivalents b/c thats what the only store in my home town carried). They were warm enough, though the felt liners got beat up pretty bad too quickly and didn't walk up steep stuff very well. They were also heavy and "clunky". I can also remember Moon boots - kinda warm but impossible to walk up anything steeper than the stairs...

I got older, moved to more "hilly" terrain and then, viola' - double boots all the way.... Nowadays, i still use my VBL sock system (evolved from the bread-bag strategy my Canadian Gram taught me), LaSportiva Nepal Extremes, and OR Brooks Range overboots/gaiters. This combination climbs beautifully and so far, never a cold toe - (knocks on head...)

Keeping warm in the winter is remarkably simple; keep everything dry, remain well-hydrated, use "just enough" insulation to keep warm, but not too much so that you get wet (from perspiration) and if all else fails, keep moving. OF course, YMMV....

fm

One trick that I have used when skiing and hiking is to use spray on anti-perspirant on my feet. Definitely keeps the sweat/freeze cycle to a minimum. Make sure that you use a true anti-perspirant, not just a deodorant.

Quietman said:

One trick that I have used when skiing and hiking is to use spray on anti-perspirant on my feet. Definitely keeps the sweat/freeze cycle to a minimum. Make sure that you use a true anti-perspirant, not just a deodorant.

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Works even better if you start a few days before the hike. I use a gel stick with a high percentage of the anti-perspirant.

Helps in street shoes too...

Doug

giggy said:

just so I have this correct - I would be judged reckless - if i was hiking mt adams on a normal winter weekend - no storms, no precip - had a fall, spent the night out and had to get carried out the next day

that would make me reckless - for wearing these leather boots?

http://www.mountainmagic.com/equipment/footwear/mountaineering/scarpa-cumbre.htm

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No, not in my book it wouldn't be reckless.

When the question comes up about the appropriateness of leather boots for winter hiker, what the person is asking is whether their 3 season leather boot , which is uninsulated and may or may not be full grain leather, will be adequate for winter hiking, and my stock answer is emphatically no - sooner or later you'll become a casualty. Having said that, there are many leather boots made for winter mountaineering, such such the one you listed. Probably won't want it for expedition use or -30F conditions, but in milder stuff it's a well-regarded boot.

"Back in the day" I used to wear "Mouse boots," insulated, rubber USAF boots that weighed about 50 pounds each. Boy was I happy when I got my first pair of Sorels!

So far this winter I've only worn my Limmer standards, but I get hot enough just walking uphill that my feet haven't gotten cold. This Sunday, though, I think it's time to bring out the doubles. After all, there's a limit to my recklessness.

Mad Townie said:

"Back in the day" I used to wear "Mouse boots," insulated, rubber USAF boots that weighed about 50 pounds each.

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Pretty goof-proof and great for stream crossings. A cool-footed friend still wears hers every now and then.

When I climbed Lions Head wearing them, I had to kick steps with the forward corner and side of the heel because the toe was too flexible...

I still have my pair. Haven't used them in the woods recently, but they were handy when the cellar flooded.

Doug

I own this Hi-Tec Igloo Winter Boots (for men) from REI outlet.


It works for me very well in white mountain winter hiking, even with crampons.
......
Comfort rating -30 degrees Fahrenheit

Split-grain leather uppers offer comfort, flex and durability

Seam-sealed Thermo-Dri® system features low-bulk Thinsulate® insulation to keep feet warm, dry and comfortable

Padded, gusseted tongues help relieve lace pressure while keeping out snow; padded cuffs add comfort at ankles

Tri-ring eyelet at front of laces for convenient gaiter attachment
Wicking linings and footbed topsheets help keep feet dry; removable, quick-drying EVA footbeds add cushioning

Compression-molded EVA midsoles offer all-day cushioning and support; fiberboard midsole supports add rigidity and insulation from cold ground
Lugged rubber outsoles supply dependable traction on snow, slush and ice

If your boots don’t fit properly – and especially if they constrict your feet significantly – they are not the right boots to be wearing in severe cold conditions, regardless of what they are made of or anything else. (They aren’t the right boots to wear under any conditions, come to think of it.)

The warmest combination I’ve found for my own hard-to-fit feet (very wide forefoot and normal heel) is a good overboot or overshoe on top of my regular hiking boots. My “technical” capacities are limited by this ensemble but my tootsies are warm and secure and I can walk or snowshoe in reasonable comfort.

This takes me back to when I was a kid. On the coldest days Mom would send me out with feet encased in old-fashion buckle-up galoshes. Underneath I’d wear regular socks and (leather) street shoes, with heavy wool “boot” socks over the shoes. Very clunky, but very warm. In later years, I’d start with nice wool “athletic” socks on my feet, then moccasins, then heavy wool boot socks over the mocs, topped off with a pair of 5-buckle “arctic” galoshes. This was even warmer than Sorels with felt liners.

G.

Grumpy, you must be around my age! Or at least your mom must have been a 50s mom like mine.

Mad Townie, I checked your public profile and it turns out you are six years my junior. My Mom definitely was a '50s mom. It was a nice era in which to to be a child.

G.

Weird! Last Sunday, before news was out about the rescue on Mt. Lafayette, I went to LL bean in North Conway for winter hiking boots. I scored a pair of -40 Sorrels, which is my preference. The nice lady there said that folks around here use the double plastics, but I held firm until she understood that I wasn't a novice. Turns out that her husband is Peter Crane of AVSAR. She said he was out on a rescue on Mt Lafayette...

Anyway, I like this type of boot. Alpine skiing gave me a mortal fear of plastic boots. When I switched to snowboard boots I felt like I was let out of prison. I wear size 12 on my size 11 feet, leaving room for two extra sets of insoles and heavy wool socks and liners.

A few times I have hiked into Tuckerman Ravine at night for photography in winter. Last time, it was well below zero. I quickly change socks when I'm done hiking, and I bring a small section of foam pad to stand on. I've spent hours standing still in those conditions in complete comfort.

Happy Trails

EMS has the Koflach Degre on sale for $194.60 until Feb 1st, which is the first time they have been on sale in five years. My sister gave me a EMS gift card for Christmas for $100.00, so my out of pocket expense is $94.60. The Concord store had my size in stock, done deal!

forestnome said:

I scored a pair of -40 Sorrels, which is my preference.

Happy Trails

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I used these boots in No. MN for my OB dogsled/ski course. (They ...or similar boots... were required gear). We also had thin felt liners in them, and wore polypro liner socks, expedition socks and vapor barriers). It was well into the minus and single digits and my feet were never cold. Because I have Raynaud's I have to be very careful. I can chill out fast.
I wear those boots to hike, my orthotics and crampons fit with no problems. This year I bought a Sorel winter hiking boot, insulated to minus 25, which I like but would not risk wearing them on very cold days. I still can't hike but a couple miles on the flats so I haven't really gotten to test them out locally very much.

My situation is a bit like Grumpy's. My feet are ultra-wide (4E) and plastics hurt and the insulation would be extremely compressed. It's also hard to find other winter mountaineering boots in extreme widths (I'm always open to suggestions). What I've settled on, for now, are some huge insulated Chippewa Boots for -40F that leave room for an extra insulating sock.

While I go prepared for overnights, I don't plan them and I am more conservative about my hikes because of them.

There are stores that will stretch plastic boots, but they won't take returns on ultra stretched boots - so it seems like a huge risk to take.