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dvbl

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Thanks to VFTT for all the great trip reports, pictures, shared knowledge, advice, funny stories, etc that I've enjoyed for the last two years. Lots of good stuff on this site. And the tightly focused moderating keeps this site from turning into a silly juvenile free-for-all blog site. However, that strict moderation tends to constrict those of us who like to debate ideas a little too truthfully and passionately. Time to call it quits and move on. In my opinion, too many of my posts have been deleted. As a result, my input is being watered down. But, hey, that's my fault. I know the site rules, and I've stepped over the line too many times. I do think there's a bit of selective enforcement of the rules, but that's an endless debate. No whining, kicking, and screaming here, just time to move on. It's been nice chatting with you. Everyone stay safe on the hills.
 
I think good debates are possible here, as long as everybody makes an effort to keep the tone polite and respectful. I'm sorry it didn't work for you (I can't do it either).

If I may, can I ask you why you feel the need to explain your departure, instead of just leaving ?


I'll miss you, there will be no more fun if all the ''great debaters'' are leaving :D

-Julie
 
I'm in a situation where I have to be out the door and just caught this thread after I logged in to check a pm. I personally have a lot to add to this thread and hope it doesn't get closed by the time I get home later today. I do want to add right now that moderating is extremely difficult and time consuming and that I can also see some of your points.
 
Mongoose said:
VFTT should have a "Free for All" forum people can opt into. It keeps people happy on other sites.
VftT (and its predecessor, rec.backcountry.useful) were started specifically as an alternative to the free for all atmosphere that exists elsewhere. Placing it in a separate forum never really keeps things separate; there's always bleed through. As such, I don't think we'll ever see something like that here.

dvbl, I'm sorry to see you go, I hope you find another site that fits your posting style.

-dave-
 
ColdRiverRun said:
I do want to add right now that moderating is extremely difficult and time consuming and that I can also see some of your points.
Moderating is certainly a thankless job. While one poster is leaving because of what he perceives as too much moderation, I left a few years ago because of what I perceived as too little moderation :D
 
David Metsky said:
VftT (and its predecessor, rec.backcountry.useful) were started specifically as an alternative to the free for all atmosphere that exists elsewhere. Placing it in a separate forum never really keeps things separate; there's always bleed through. As such, I don't think we'll ever see something like that here.
Right now there are a lot of satellite Google Groups and Yahoo Groups. They're easy to start up, you can keep them private if you like, you can invite who you like, and you're pretty much free to do whatever you like in them. They're also free.

-Dr. Wu
 
Don't know if you'll be coming back to check responses to your departure or not, but I looked at your past posts and they go all the way back to 2005, not too, too long ago but you packed a lot of insight into those posts, and I for one, being a newer member will miss that. I'm assuming you look in on other sites similar to this and each one has a distinctive style and it would seem as if there's no problem in participating in multiple forum platforms on the web, I don't think anyone would view that as traitorous (or would they? :) ). Variety is great.
This isn't a Bill Parcells like departure is it, building up anticipation for a return at a later date? :D
 
Mohamed Ellozy said:
Moderating is certainly a thankless job. While one poster is leaving because of what he perceives as too much moderation, I left a few years ago because of what I perceived as too little moderation :D
Just wanted to add this too, I also appreciate moderation, I like a site that is good enough that I can yell out to my wife or teenage daughter and they can come check out this post and,OK, maybe gasp, but then laugh because its a specific type of humor and thinking that goes on here. Its a part of hiking culture, there's rules and laws everywhere but a lot of freedom exists under that umbrella. I appreciate the hard work everyone does, from posters to moderators, to creators of the site, I'm sure everyone else does too.
 
I enjoy debate as much as the next gal, but rather than try to bring it somewhere where it's not welcome, I'm more inclined to join a few different boards to fill in the gaps. Works for me. Maybe it would work for you as well, dvbl. :cool:
 
Neil said:
Yeah, it's like having a "no peeing" section in a swimming pool.
Don't ever leave, Neil. I'd miss your pithy insights ... (I think!)
 
There is no need to leave

You just need to accept this site for what it is intended to be - a focused hiking site (trail conditions, trip reports, helpful info related to same, etc.).

Using it to discuss current politico-enviro issues, etc. would be like using a spoon to cut a steak.

There is a time and place for everything.
 
David Metsky said:
VftT (and its predecessor, rec.backcountry.useful) were started specifically as an alternative to the free for all atmosphere that exists elsewhere. Placing it in a separate forum never really keeps things separate; there's always bleed through. As such, I don't think we'll ever see something like that here.
dvbl, I'm sorry to see you go, I hope you find another site that fits your posting style.

-dave-

Well said. One thing I love about this board is that it IS tightly moderated and focused on hiking.
 
Based on my experience with posts like this in the past, do you want me to delete your account or do you want me to leave it active for when you return to the site next year?

- darren
 
darren said:
Based on my experience with posts like this in the past, do you want me to delete your account or do you want me to leave it active for when you return to the site next year?

- darren

:D Good one. Good photographer AND a funny guy. Awesome.

Just in case you didn't get the email I sent you at about 7:30 this morning, I'll copy/paste it here for you

Darren, please discontinue my membership. Thanks.

- dvbl


I hope that answers your question.
 
Well, since I lasted posted a lot has been added that I wanted like statements by Gris and JJhikes.

I don’t have enough experience to know about the “selective” moderation, although it does seem like I see that at times. I think it might have to do with knowing a poster. I don’t mean in a “he is my friend he can say what he wants” type of manner but understanding the background, tone, or previous statements of an individual for reference. I actually think that mods can be harder on friends because it is easier for them to just send a pm or e-mail saying “What the hell” instead of trying to come up with how to word as not to offend type of statements.

I only recently joined this site because of how I knew most online forums operate and can get out of control. It is mostly due to the non-physicality of it. I remembered a post I had encountered by Cave dog when he stated:
“There seems to be something inherent to this kind of communication that, when emotions get involved, it tends to lead to misperceptions about the other person or their point of view. Certainly the anonymity is part of it. The fact that it is really less a dialogue than concurrent monologues, seems to be part of it too. Timing may be at play, at times. The fact that it has created a culture of memos instead of letters may be a factor as well. I also feel it has something to do with not being able to see or hear the person you are communicating with. It makes it harder to understand emphasis. I feel like people sometimes overcompensate by adding meaning to their words that sometimes goes astray to their feelings.”

I know peakbagr (Alan) for one has been part of other sites that had those types of debatable topics and saw first hand how things can just get people so upset that if said in a proper context wouldn’t have even been noticed.

I find that people lose site of the common ground same team line of thinking. Most of us here are here because of what we share in common with the love of the outdoors not because we were forced here. But I see threads about things like say “list hiking” and people almost seem to get mad at others for being part of that group. Think about the idea really of finding someone that has comparable abilities, love of doing something that you love, might use M+C instead of GPS like you like to do bushwhacking, want to go explore the same area and then saying, “wait you are doing this for a list, oh well I’m not going then”.

I can give an example of my own experience. I’m friends with Black spruce of this board, who is a soon to be 55 yr of woman whose first language is French. I’m a soon to be 31 yr old speed hiker/bushwhacker if I had to categorize myself who talks as I’m told extremely fast. Yet we hike together as much as possible. She told me that hiking with me was much different than she expected after we came out of 9+ miles of bushwhacking on top of trail mileage one day. I added the note that it was bushwhacking because you have your temper and patience challenge a lot during that type of hike and will test personable boundaries. We had a lot in common and never discussed any difference that probably existed because we enjoyed the parts we shared so much. And because I’ve gotten to know her I get her personality and sense of humor more than other people seem to that almost don’t know how to react at times.

I find that I try to follow the statement “If you can’t say anything nice don’t say anything at all” and turn it into the internet version “if you can’t post something positive or aren’t adding to something in a positive way don’t post”. I don’t post in most argument type of threads and I don’t post “fishing sucks” in a thread about fishing.
This new form, since it is different than letter writing type of communication needs it own etiquette rules like anything else. Now if we can get some cell phone etiquette rules in place we would be all set.
:D
 
dvbl said:
:D Good one. Good photographer AND a funny guy. Awesome.

Just in case you didn't get the email I sent you at about 7:30 this morning, I'll copy/paste it here for you

Darren, please discontinue my membership. Thanks.

- dvbl


I hope that answers your question.


Fair enough.

I will refund the remainer of your membership dues. :D

- darren
 
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