Whiteface Auto Road - Does it count

Currently there is a Mt. Washington Road question on the NH pages but I'm thinking Summer for this trip.

The Plan:

Hike up Esther & Whiteface, meet my family who drive up the road. At the top, switch my pack & boots for a pair of running shoes & a bottle of water & then jog down the road.

Does it count for the 46'ers? On this trip I only need Esther for the list. Would it be better if I carry the running shoes & just let my family cart the pack & boots back?

Mike P. said:

Currently there is a Mt. Washington Road question on the NH pages but I'm thinking Summer for this trip.

The Plan:

Hike up Esther & Whiteface, meet my family who drive up the road. At the top, switch my pack & boots for a pair of running shoes & a bottle of water & then jog down the road.

Does it count for the 46'ers? On this trip I only need Esther for the list. Would it be better if I carry the running shoes & just let my family cart the pack & boots back?

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It's not legal to walk the road when there are cars on it. But what the 46Rs would say, I'm not sure. It's fine to do what you propose in winter.

I know of people that hike up it in winter and then ski back down and it does count!

You have to walk down the trail or the road it doesn't matter but as a correspondent I would likely cringe upon learning that a car took all of your gear down and that you changed into gear that was carried up for you by a vehicle!

The climbing of the 46 is based on the honnor system, in the end the climber himself is the only judge of what's acceptable and what isn't!

BlackSpruce said:

You have to walk down the trail or the road it doesn't matter but as a correspondent I would likely cringe upon learning that a car took all of your gear down and that you changed into gear that was carried up for you by a vehicle!

The climbing of the 46 is based on the honnor system, in the end the climber himself is the only judge of what's acceptable and what isn't!

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I would have to totally agree with Black Spruce on this one.

One must hike up and down the trail OR road for the ascent of Whiteface to count and in this case Esther too, since that is the peak that you are wanting to get, that should include the gear too, since you will be carrying it. This includes No Elevator ride up OR down for the last 300' of Whiteface.

Tom is absolutely right, No Pedestrians are allowed on the Toll Road when it is open starting around April-October. The Forty Sixers appreciate that climbers respect the rules of Landowners when climbing and this is a rule for the Toll Road of Whiteface, as is No Dogs, No Bikes, etc. at the AuSable Club.

Mike P. said:

Currently there is a Mt. Washington Road question on the NH pages but I'm thinking Summer for this trip.

The Plan:

Hike up Esther & Whiteface, meet my family who drive up the road. At the top, switch my pack & boots for a pair of running shoes & a bottle of water & then jog down the road.

Does it count for the 46'ers? On this trip I only need Esther for the list. Would it be better if I carry the running shoes & just let my family cart the pack & boots back?

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Leaving aside the question of if it counts for the 46er's (which I'm not qualified to answer), I'd only emphasize the following in strongly urging you against it.

1) As Tom & Skyclimber point out - If the road is open, it's not ALLOWED, and it's clearly marked at the gated entry point. That alone, should discourage you.

2) It would be EXTREMELY unsafe if the road is open to traffic. Remember, because its clearly marked for vehicular traffic only, motorists are NOT EXPECTING pedestrian runners, walker along the way and may not see you. There are many switchbacks (blind turns) on the road and plenty of views all the way up the road, so drivers have plenty of other things on their mind both going up and going down and suddenly coming upon a pedestrian along the way is a serious recipe for disaster. Bottom line: It's not safe for you, or for the unsuspecting tourists driving the road to do what you propose.

You are MUCH safer going up and going down the trailed route (they're not all that hard anyway). Here's what I've done (and it's the bomb). Have you're family meet you at the top, with a NICE picnic lunch full of stuff you wouldn't want to carry, and chow down like a champ when you get on top. Then head on down the regular hiker route satisfied and full. It allows for a lighter pack (less food), gives you a great summit lunch, and keeps you safe. Or you could just bring some cash and buy a hamburger .

I'm not certain of this, just asking...

Doesn't the road close at night and during rain or fog? If so, it would be safe to walk or run the road when its closed, but that would preclude meeting family on top.

Thanks for the replies gang.

What time does the road close? (I could look it up, it's just a hypothetical at this point) Could you jog down in the evening after it closes if there is still some light.

I'm not looking to do something illegal. (Other than the speeding to get to there & maybe a cell call while the car is moving... )

I could carry the sneakers up & hike in running shorts, So it's just a fanny pack being carried down. Probably could try trail jogging although I'd spend more time looking down at my feet than looking around, Great vistas along the road.

Just trying to get some hiking in. The last couple of years I've gone hiking in the ADK's while the family was still at the beach. May not be able to do that this year so trying to combine big hikes with family time. They are not up to Esther or Whiteface, maybe Cascade this year.

PS: I've driven the road before....

Mike P. said:

Thanks for the replies gang.

What time does the road close? (I could look it up, it's just a hypothetical at this point) Could you jog down in the evening after it closes if there is still some light.

I'm not looking to do something illegal. (Other than the speeding to get to there & maybe a cell call while the car is moving... )

I could carry the sneakers up & hike in running shorts, So it's just a fanny pack being carried down. Probably could try trail jogging although I'd spend more time looking down at my feet than looking around, Great vistas along the road.

Just trying to get some hiking in. The last couple of years I've gone hiking in the ADK's while the family was still at the beach. May not be able to do that this year so trying to combine big hikes with family time. They are not up to Esther or Whiteface, maybe Cascade this year.

PS: I've driven the road before....

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I suggest you forget the ""Does it Count" bit and

1) hike up
2) meet family for big picnic lunch
3) hop in car and go home with family.

Remember the hike up, views, lunch and even the ride down (with different views) is still fun regardless of any list.

Better yet - meet the family in the lot and take the elevator up with them. You may never get another chance at finishing the "ADK Elevators which start above 4000' list"

Come to think of it, what did we do before we heard about lists? I guess we never went hiking.

OK, let's say that you climb up a peak -any peak- and change into some different clothes. Your hiking buddy carries your pack down. Would that count?

dug said:

OK, let's say that you climb up a peak -any peak- and change into some different clothes. Your hiking buddy carries your pack down. Would that count?

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If you take that to its logical extreme, if I pack out your candy bar wrapper, your hike should be invalidated!

What if I have to help you up a small, steep cliff, because I am taller than you and you can not get up w/o help? Does that count?

How about this: Usually, if you hike to peak a, and then peak b, b counts, even though it may be a lot easier to do b from a than from some trailhead. So, what if I drive to a and hike to b? Does b count? And what if I hike back to a, does a now count?

Man, you guys will find anything to argue about, huh.

The several discussions about "Does it count?" reminds me of an incident this weekend. We visited my son's family and we ordered Chinese Take-out Saturday night. The two grandchildren (age 3 and 6) were excited about using chopsticks.

Grandson (6 yo) fumbled heroically with his sticks and finally got a few of the morsels he wanted.

Granddaughter (3 yo) was given chopsticks made for little kids that are joined at the top which make it easier to get something in your mouth.

Grandson promptly said "Those aren't real chopsticks so it doesn't count!"

Of course there's no comparison to the lofty discussion here.

"Of course there's no comparison to the lofty discussion here"

Spraying the monitor with soda here.

Tom Rankin said:

If you take that to its logical extreme, if I pack out your candy bar wrapper, your hike should be invalidated!

What if I have to help you up a small, steep cliff, because I am taller than you and you can not get up w/o help? Does that count?

How about this: Usually, if you hike to peak a, and then peak b, b counts, even though it may be a lot easier to do b from a than from some trailhead. So, what if I drive to a and hike to b? Does b count? And what if I hike back to a, does a now count?

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NOW I AM CONFUSED

Winter time the road counts! Summertime during the day NO cause of the traffic!

What if you hike up the mountain and a large Samoan man or a Yeti carries you down? Does that count? Honestly, just do it for your own peace of mind. If I thought I climbed a certain group of mountains in a state and some purist weirdo told me that I did not conform to a specified set of rules, I would not care, I might stick a banana in his tailpipe. I suggest carrying a mountain bike on your back up the mountain and then riding it down. That would count in my book, I would give you two patches, and a double high five. Hike your own hike, just don't get run over by a big SUV.

and some purist weirdo told me that I did not conform to a specified set of rules, I would not care, I might stick a banana in his tailpipe.


Well, thanks but no thanks! The FORTY-SIXERS corespondent job pays really well but I may have to get in touch with my union representative about that one as I am not sure our insurance covers that kind of injury...



Christine

king tut said:

Hike your own hike.

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Your majesty, my own hike is conforming to the rules.

That's my own hike, and I'm going to hike it! I get a lot of satisfaction from it.

BlackSpruce said:

and some purist weirdo told me that I did not conform to a specified set of rules, I would not care, I might stick a banana in his tailpipe.


Well, thanks but no thanks! The FORTY-SIXERS corespondent job pays really well but I may have to get in touch with my union representative about that one as I am not sure our insurance covers that kind of injury...



Christine

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Beverly Hills Cop reference, not the "human" tailpipe, an automobile reference. No judgement here, I am sure Freud could pull up a couch for you.

Interesting and brainy discussion here. The Veterans Memorial Highway on Whiteface Mtn. opens for the season in mid-May, around the 3rd weekend. I hiked it on May 11 a few years ago and had the summit all to myself.

The road counts anytime of year, but you can't legally use the road while it's open to traffic. The idea of walking down the road after it's closed for the day would probably mean you'd have to find a place to hang out until the employee traffic has gone down to Wilmington - it might not be worth the wait. I'd recommend that you just meet your family up there, spend some summit time with them, then walk back down the trail with all the gear that you carried up.