Polar Bears heading inland

Chip said:

Good thing I'm all caught up at work...here's some more reading on the subject.

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I am not caught up at work, but good stuff in this link, especially some of the comments at the bottom. Thanks.

DOUG PAUL:

Actually, the brown bear (originally found throughout northern eurasia, northern North America and elsewhere, is the species (ursus arctos).
The grizzly is a geographic subspecies, (ursus arctos horriblis) as is the enormous Kodiak bear. The article I cited indicates that both grizzlies and browns in general can interbreed with polars.

<<Scientific evidence has found that the brown bear, a species that also includes grizzly bears, was a "precursor" to polar bears, which then went on to develop specializations for inhabiting the harsh Arctic.>>

<<...brown bears and polar bears can mate and produce viable, or fertile, offspring... (which) establishes that an animal belongs within a given species.

<<In 2006, a hybrid grizzly/polar bear, which some call a "pizzly," was discovered in the Canadian Arctic>>

<<Analysis of the DNA of a distinct population of brown bears living on Alaska's ABC islands, 900 miles south of the nearest polar bear, revealed that the ABC bears were even more closely related to polar bears genetically than they were to other brown bears>>.

Perhaps if McDonalds built more restaurants on the coast and left their dumpsters open the bears wouldn't move so far inland.

Little Rickie said:

Perhaps if McDonalds built more restaurants on the coast and left their dumpsters open the bears wouldn't move so far inland.

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Like the polar bears of Churchill on western Hudson Bay, who are arriving earlier and earlier each fall.

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/nature/polarbear/

It kind of pisses me off.

The one animal that is left handed, and the government does not want to protect it. That is total discrimination.

Us left handers have been called evil and sinister through the ages.....We are, but that is besides the point. Now we are not worthy of taking some steps to protect us.

Polar bears are going to be reduced to driving Zamboni machines at NHL hockey games and eating spectators.....And there aren't too many fans anymore.

Screw the right flippered seals political action committees. We are waiting over breathing holes seals. Be warned.

moonrock said:

Actually, the brown bear (originally found throughout northern eurasia, northern North America and elsewhere, is the species (ursus arctos).
The grizzly is a geographic subspecies, (ursus arctos horriblis) as is the enormous Kodiak bear. The article I cited indicates that both grizzlies and browns in general can interbreed with polars.

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Stephen Herrero (in "Bear Attacks: Their Causes and Avoidance", revised edition, pg 132-133 http://www.amazon.com/Bear-Attacks-...=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1207195310&sr=8-1 ) states it somewhat differently. Ursus arctos is the species which includes both what are commonly called grizzlies (subspecies Ursus arctos horriblis) and Kodiak bears (subspecies Ursus arctos middendorffi). He uses the term grizzly to refer to both in the book. (The large coastal Alaskan bears commonly called Alaskan brown bears are, according to him, just well fed Ursus arctos horriblis.)

The ability to interbreed is evidence that two animals are of the same species. Thus the ability of Kodiak, grizzly (including Alaskan brown) bears, and polar bears to interbreed suggests that they all are of the same species. (In practice the dividing line between deciding that two organisms are related subspecies or that they are separate species can be fuzzy.)

BTW, Herrero notes the views of C. Hart Merriam recognizing eighty six species and subspecies of Ursus arctos in North America in a 1918 reference. (This view was not accepted.)

FWIW, Herrero does not cover polar bears. Another source gives their species name as Ursus maritimus.

FWIW2, Herrero lists the American black bear species as Ursus americanus.

Doug

These guys know from polar bears: Polar Bears by Peter Clarkson and Ian Stirling.

Brown bear (ursus arctos) also formerly inhabited the Atlas Mountains of NE Africa. Ursus arctos berengia (sp ?) inhabits the Kamchatka peninsula.

My understanding was that the Kodiak was selected for large(r) size because of its island habitat (hmmm..maybe to bring down the dwarf mammoths ??).

It is possible that "grizzly" is multi-use term, used taxonomically, or simply to connote any bear with the characteristic guard-hair coloration.

It is interesting that black bear hybrids are not nearly as well documented; they reportedly genetically split much earlier (5-7 MA). There was one report of a captive brown-black hybrid litter, but none survived to adulthood and therefore may not have been reproductively viable. (To confuse: Black bear species includes a brown "cinnamon" and white Columbian color phase).

Check out what happens to "liger" - lion/tiger hybrids; they keep growing larger their entire adult life !
http://www.vet.upenn.edu/schoolresources/communications/publications/bellwether/62/images/liger.jpg

Thanks!

Enjoyed reading all of the interesting replies to this thread.

Best wishes in ANWR, Dottie, and if you can afford to hire a local guide, great. Some of the best memories from my 20+ months in the Arctic have been those from times I have spent with the Inuit.

dr. d., thanks for the post and for your encouragement. i hope to have very good info. to share w/ VFTT.

d.

related site to check into

www.saveoursnowfoundation.org