GUide Cards & $500 Fine

Hot off the AMC YM Leaders Guide:

The White Mountain National Forest (WMNF) and the AMC have an arrangement where the Forest Service "allows" the AMC to use their lands in exchange for information on usage. Under this program, AMC leaders are issued WMNF Guide Cards and are asked to file trip report forms with the National Forest. A maximum of 10 people are allowed on each card! If you take more than 10 people you will need additional leaders and at least one other card. You will also technically need to "split" the group.

These cards are distributed to select leaders, and their names and contact information are below. Contact them if you need to borrow a card. You (not the AMC) will be fined $500 by the Forest Service if you lead an AMC trip in the WMNF without a guide card

Can this be true? Do we face the possibilty of a $500 fine for leading trips in our National Forest for AMC w/o a card ?

As the kids I work with say...."not for nuthing".

If you are leading trips, especially for the AMC (I am assuming chapters) and you don't know about the OFG cards, then I would suggest contacting.

Jennifer Batt, U.S. Forest Service, 300 Glen Road, Gorham, NH 03581-1399. Or call 603-466-2713, ext. 213.

They are easy enough to get and a matter of paper work.

FWIW...at some major trailheads rangers will ask for them. As far as a fine...technically speaking I am sure one exists…but never heard of it being imposed.

On a “Hikebob” hike we were asked for one this past winter but that is a story for another day.

Peace.

BTW this is a bit of a rant

The enforcement of the guide permit has changed on a random basis over the years and unfortunately, there isnt a lot of rhyme or reason. The strict interpretation of the statute is that anyone who "leads" an organized "group" is required to obtain the card. Over the years, the administration has been by district, so what applied in part of the whites did not apply in other parts. Usually the permits have been limited to trips where someone is getting "paid" to run the trip. Unfortunately a few nonprofit organizations skirted the issue, by allowing their name to be associated with profit making trips. The practice of paying the trip leaders "expenses" got a bit out of hand. This eventually shifted it to all groups, but the enforcement was a joke with most of the Forest Service staff. (pick any weekend on the Tuckermans Ravine trail and the forest service could fund their budget by busting church groups and other non profits).

One area that the permits have been fairly well enforced in the past is the Lincoln woods trailhead. They can and do write tickets to groups. We were followed up the trail all the way to the Bondcliff junction by a ranger that waited to make sure that we werent camping at the restricted area and then checked our permit several years ago

Note that getting a permit isnt that difficult if you are affiliated with a non profit but be aware that dependent on the district, you may be limited to where you can go in the whites. For at least a couple of years, permits were issued with conditions that the group could not go into the Great Gulf or Pemi areas. If your permit is defined as commercial, the conditions can get quite restrictive, the llama treking outfit in Bethel was restricted to the 113 area or the kilkennys.

I havent filed for one lately, but the main condition was that you had to report out your trips on a yearly basis.

The permits have also been used in the past to bust groups that exceed 10, as the permit document makes it quite clear that exceeding 10 is a violation of the permit. This includes camping together, so that cuts out the standard trick of taking a big group and splitting them up by 5 or 10 minute intervals.

IMHO If the rules were enforced uniformly, I think that it would better the experience in the backcountry. Although a minority of the groups are better behaved and trained than the typical weekend warriors, the majority of large groups I have encountered on the most popular trails tend to be very disruptive and frequently unequipped for the trips they elect to make. I have been at Guyot at least twice when poorly conditioned, and overly large (20+) youth groups have staggered in and proceeded to ruin the evening for everyone else at the site. By enforcing the permit system, I suspect it would cut back a bit on the unprepared groups and last minute trips

Jaytrek57 said:

If you are leading trips, especially for the AMC (I am assuming chapters) and you don't know about the OFG cards, then I would suggest contacting.

Mary Ann Leberman, U.S. Forest Service, 300 Glen Road, Gorham, NH 03581-1399. Or call 603-466-2713, ext. 216.

Click to expand...

You are right! The cards are easy to obtain. I had several sent to me for distribution to other CT trip Leaders. All the Forest Service asks is the leader fill out a simple trip report. This is used to monitor trail usage.

Also note the new contact for the FS.