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Thread: The latest sunrise date and time (in the NE) is ...

  1. #1
    Senior Member Tom Rankin's Avatar
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    The latest sunrise date and time (in the NE) is ...

    Ok, no references allowed!

    Any guesses?

    BikeHike and LordMarc are excluded from answering, as I used them for Guinea Pigs.

    Hint: Your first thought is probably incorrect.
    Tom Rankin
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  2. #2
    Senior Member Puma concolor's Avatar
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    Not entirely sure I understand what you are asking. Obviously, the sun came up today so the date of the latest sunrise would be 11/22/09. Are you trying to trick us with a question about the TIME of the sunrise. Generally, it is light out for a good little bit before the official sunrise ...

    So going back to several days ago when I drove up to Vermont ... let's see, I crossed the NY/VT border at 6:07 AM and it was still dark. Probably started to get bright out within 15 minutes or so. So let's say first light was at 6:22 AM. Add about 40 minutes on until the official sunrise. 7:00 AMish?

    So I'll say 11/22/09 at 7:00 AM. Sure it's probably wrong but it at least gets the ball rolling.

  3. #3
    Senior Member brianW's Avatar
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    January 6th? I know its not on the solstice.
    " The more I study nature, the more I stand amazed at the work of the Creator" -Louis Pasteur

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    Senior Member sardog1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Rankin View Post
    Ok, no references allowed!

    Any guesses?

    BikeHike and LordMarc are excluded from answering, as I used them for Guinea Pigs.

    Hint: Your first thought is probably incorrect.
    My first thought was incorrect.

    My second thought was incorrect.

    My third thought is correct, and I'm gonna whack you upside the head with it if you stray from the correct answer when you reveal yours. A hint: I was totally anal in answering the question that you have posed. 'Nuff said . . . fer now.

    BTW, I enjoyed this little exercise -- thanks!
    sardog1

    "Å! kjære Bymann gakk ei stjur og stiv,
    men kom her up og kjenn eit annat Liv!
    kom hit, kom hit, og ver ei daud og lat!
    kom kjenn, hot d'er, som heiter Svevn og Mat,
    og Drykk og Tørste og det heile, som
    er Liv og Helse i ein Hovedsum."

    -- Aasmund O. Vinje, "Til Fjells!"

  5. #5
    Senior Member Puma concolor's Avatar
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    OK, so now I'll assume that by "latest," you don't mean most recent. Perhaps you mean the day in each calendar year where the sunrise is the latest. In that case, my guess would be the last day of daylight savings time. This year, I believe that was Halloween. I'll put the time of the sunrise somewhere around 7:30 AM.
    Last edited by Puma concolor; 11-23-2009 at 05:50 AM. Reason: wrong word

  6. #6
    Senior Member Tom Rankin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Puma concolor View Post
    OK, so now I'll assume that by "latest," you don't mean most recent. Perhaps you mean the day in each calendar year where the sunrise is the latest. In that case, my guess would be the last day of daylight savings time. This year, I believe that was Halloween. I'll put the time of the sunrise somewhere around 7:30 AM.
    Ding! Ding!

    Winner!

    Explanation

    This link:

    http://www.dlmcn.com/eqntime.html

    shows why the Winter Solstice is not correct. But this assumes no DST. w/o DST, the answer
    would have been some time in early January, around 7:20 AM.

    However, with the 'new' DST, the latest sunrise time in the NE is now the last day of DST.

    This year, it was 10/31.

    DST can now end as late as November 7th, so this
    could be even later in future years.

    This link:

    http://www.sunrisesunset.com/calenda...pe=0&use_dst=1

    shows sunrise (and sunset) times for NYC. As you can see, the latest sunrise time is now around
    7:25 AM. You get similar results with Boston.

    I did not do exhaustive research on this to see when and where it is true.

    A Brief History of Time (Daylight Savings version that is):

    http://aa.usno.navy.mil/faq/docs/daylight_time.php

    SARDog: I'm quaking in my hiking boots!
    Tom Rankin
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  7. #7
    Senior Member Tom Rankin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sardog1 View Post
    My first thought was incorrect.

    My second thought was incorrect.

    My third thought is correct, and I'm gonna whack you upside the head with it if you stray from the correct answer when you reveal yours. A hint: I was totally anal in answering the question that you have posed. 'Nuff said . . . fer now.

    BTW, I enjoyed this little exercise -- thanks!
    I was going to post 'your 2nd thought is probably incorrect as well', but that sounded a little arrogant!
    Tom Rankin
    Volunteer Balsam Lake Mountain
    Past President Catskill 3500 Club
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  8. #8
    Senior Member Puma concolor's Avatar
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    Wow! Thanks for the PM, Tom. An all-expenses paid trip to the land of the midnight sun just for winning this little quizzer!?! Very appropriate prize but more than I could ever accept. Oh, OK, you talked me into it. When do I leave?

    FWIW, I really dislike daylight savings now extending into November. I frequently have to be at work by 7 AM and it is no fun doing the entire commute in the dark in OCTOBER. I mean, you kind of expect it in December and January. But October is just waaaay too early for sunrises that late. For whatever reason, I really noticed it this year.

  9. #9
    Senior Member sardog1's Avatar
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    Better get ready, here comes the whackin'.

    The latest sunrise time in the Northeastern United States is 7:51 a.m., EST, or 12:51 GMT. Your time of 7:25 a.m. EDT is 11:25 GMT, so it is not later.

    The latest sunrise time in the Northeastern United States is experienced at this point in Pennsylvania in Lake Erie from December 31 through January 7, 2010:

    http://www.heavens-above.com/sun.asp...178.6604513889



    (If you think that PA is not part of the Northeast, then the next latest time is in New York's portion of Lake Erie at 7:49 a.m. EST or 12:49 GMT.)

    I am not able to refine this time to anything finer than minutes without more work than I want to do. I'm anal on this point, not nuts.

    I started by thinking that the location would be near Fort Kent, Maine, as that is the farthest north point in the Northeast. Then I realized that a point farther west in the same time zone would have a later sunrise time. Then I found out that some folks consider PA to be part of the Northeast; I tend to think of it as Middle Atlantic.

    So, where do I pick up my prize?
    Last edited by sardog1; 11-23-2009 at 10:26 AM.
    sardog1

    "Å! kjære Bymann gakk ei stjur og stiv,
    men kom her up og kjenn eit annat Liv!
    kom hit, kom hit, og ver ei daud og lat!
    kom kjenn, hot d'er, som heiter Svevn og Mat,
    og Drykk og Tørste og det heile, som
    er Liv og Helse i ein Hovedsum."

    -- Aasmund O. Vinje, "Til Fjells!"

  10. #10
    Senior Member Tom Rankin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sardog1 View Post
    Better get ready, here comes the whackin'.

    ...

    So, where do I pick up my prize?
    If you ask surnisesunset.com for either Cleveland, OH or Pittsburgh, PA, (that webpage only has big cities), the end of DST is still the latest sunrise.

    So, P.C. still has the vacation! (Very appropriate choice of destinations, BTW!)

    But you had me scared for a minute!
    Tom Rankin
    Volunteer Balsam Lake Mountain
    Past President Catskill 3500 Club
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  11. #11
    Senior Member sardog1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Rankin View Post
    If you ask surnisesunset.com for either Cleveland, OH or Pittsburgh, PA, (that webpage only has big cities), the end of DST is still the latest sunrise.

    So, P.C. still has the vacation! (Very appropriate choice of destinations, BTW!)

    But you had me scared for a minute!

    Huh? The times on sunrisesunset.com are in EDT for October. EDT is four hours behind GMT. EST is five hours behind GMT. If you use sunrisesunset.com for Pittsburgh, the latest time is at 7:42 a.m. EST, or 12:42 GMT, starting on December 28 and going forward for several days.

    I'm warming up my whackin' stick . . .
    Last edited by sardog1; 11-23-2009 at 01:32 PM. Reason: Corrected to refer to Pittsburgh, not Philly.
    sardog1

    "Å! kjære Bymann gakk ei stjur og stiv,
    men kom her up og kjenn eit annat Liv!
    kom hit, kom hit, og ver ei daud og lat!
    kom kjenn, hot d'er, som heiter Svevn og Mat,
    og Drykk og Tørste og det heile, som
    er Liv og Helse i ein Hovedsum."

    -- Aasmund O. Vinje, "Til Fjells!"

  12. #12
    Senior Member Puck's Avatar
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    Next time a map of erie county PA is posted, please zoom out to include Meadville. There are some people on VFTT who went to college there and they would appreciate the homecoming.
    Trail adopter Dry river Cut-off.

  13. #13
    Senior Member Tom Rankin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sardog1 View Post
    Huh? The times on sunrisesunset.com are in EDT for October. EDT is four hours behind GMT. EST is five hours behind GMT. If you use sunrisesunset.com for Pittsburgh, the latest time is at 7:42 a.m. EST, or 12:42 GMT, starting on December 28 and going forward for several days.

    I'm warming up my whackin' stick . . .
    Maybe we're talking across each other here. The Sunrise time for late October is later than early January everywhere in the North East, in civil time, not converting it back to GMT. I'm talking about perception, not reality!
    Tom Rankin
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  14. #14
    Senior Member RollingRock's Avatar
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    Using a completely different source it confirms that Halloween is correct ~ but by only 3 minutes compared to early January.
    GayOutdoors.org
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  15. #15
    Moderator bikehikeskifish's Avatar
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    Aren't you glad you vetted the original phrasing on me and Marc?

    Tim
    Bike, Hike, Ski, Sleep. Eat, Fish, Repeat.

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