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Thread: "Leave the Snow Shoes in the Car"???

  1. #16
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    This thread appears once a year-- I am surprised it took so long.

    Anyhow, if you are hiking on trail that is skied, please have extra consideration for those of us whose tendons are becoming brittle.

    Thanks.

  2. #17
    Senior Member TrishandAlex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ColdRiverRun View Post
    This is a new one for me. So you think it's the shape of the snowshoe or what?

    I think I understand the physical condition your describing so maybe I can suggest a different reason. You said you only switch to snowshoes when you need to. That suggest that the snow is either getting soft or you are in fact breaking trail. During those conditions you are physically working much harder going uphill which would lead to a higher heart rate and cause possible cramping in areas where you have bad circulation.
    Yes, it's a circulation issue. The shoes do feel heavy on that particular leg.

    I have MSRs, and those are the only ones I've ever had, so maybe it is the shape? I've assumed it is the weight, since they feel heavy on that particular foot. My boots are fine (Sorels) and adhere to the shape of my foot, while the snowshoes don't. I'm moving the weight differently with snowshoe than I am with boots, due to the fact that the snowshoes are much wider than my actual foot (as they should be, since they're snowshoes). I have adjusted the straps every which way, but the problem persists.

    ETA: To clarify -- I DO put on snowshoes after I've postholed twice. I'm not endorsing postholing, just shrugging at those who become overly incensed at the issue.
    Last edited by TrishandAlex; 03-07-2010 at 08:34 PM.
    [B][SIZE=3]Patricia Ellis Herr (TRISH...ALEX...SAGE)


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  3. #18
    Senior Member TrishandAlex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Remix View Post
    This thread appears once a year-- I am surprised it took so long.

    Anyhow, if you are hiking on trail that is skied, please have extra consideration for those of us whose tendons are becoming brittle.

    Thanks.
    This brings up a good question -- which trails are commonly skied? Most of the hiking trails I've been on don't seem condusive to skiing. But I'm not a skier, so I don't have any real sense of what is considered ski-able.
    [B][SIZE=3]Patricia Ellis Herr (TRISH...ALEX...SAGE)


    Those who say it cannot be done should get out of the way of those doing it. --Chinese proverb.

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  4. #19
    Senior Member Paradox's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paul ron View Post
    ...
    Yeah every year the same conversation.. time for a lock down.
    This information is not written in stone, but rather ice and snow. Every spring the knowledge fades faster than my short term memory. It goes away with warm weather and a new group of hikers that do not have the benefit of our experience. It will continue on, as long as we have new hikers, equipment, and desire. It's a good thing I wrote this down, or I would have forgotten it already.
    WNH4K:48/48, SLAT50:50/50, NEHH:100/100, NE115:115/115,
    TW72:60/72, WADK46: 18/46, 52WAV:16/52, Cat35:9/35(39)

  5. #20
    Senior Member TrishandAlex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paul ron View Post
    I see you're getting a bit moist under the collar, must be the guilt. Why not break out your own trail as a barebooter?.. .or is it too hard for ya mountain man? Need the snowshoers to do that for ya? Where is the adventure in trashing a nice trail when you can be ass high in snow, a real man's adventure n occomplishment? I'm just sayin...

    Yeah every year the same conversation.. time for a lock down.
    Nah, my response was purely academic. There are very few things I get "moist under the collar" over...unlike some...

    You might want to read entire posts before responding. As I've already written, I do carry snowshoes, and I wear them when needed. I've even -- gasp -- broken out trail in snowshoes -- with barebooters right behind me. Did I care? No.
    Last edited by TrishandAlex; 03-07-2010 at 09:28 PM.
    [B][SIZE=3]Patricia Ellis Herr (TRISH...ALEX...SAGE)


    Those who say it cannot be done should get out of the way of those doing it. --Chinese proverb.

    For more info about The Terrifying 25, contact me at patriciaellisherr@hotmail.com or search for The Terrifying 25 on Facebook.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrishandAlex View Post
    This brings up a good question -- which trails are commonly skied? Most of the hiking trails I've been on don't seem condusive to skiing. But I'm not a skier, so I don't have any real sense of what is considered ski-able.

    Well there isn't a formal list, of course. Obviously, seeing tracks, skiers, or consulting one of the best-places-to-backcountry-ski books are ways to make a list.

  7. #22
    Senior Member TrishandAlex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Remix View Post
    Well there isn't a formal list, of course. Obviously, seeing tracks, skiers, or consulting one of the best-places-to-backcountry-ski books is a way to make a list.
    Thanks. Not being a skiier, it isn't obvious to me which trails are considered ski-able. I've only seen skiiers on two hiking trails, didn't know it was that common to ski down them.
    [B][SIZE=3]Patricia Ellis Herr (TRISH...ALEX...SAGE)


    Those who say it cannot be done should get out of the way of those doing it. --Chinese proverb.

    For more info about The Terrifying 25, contact me at patriciaellisherr@hotmail.com or search for The Terrifying 25 on Facebook.

  8. #23
    Moderator David Metsky's Avatar
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    Dial it back a notch, everyone. It's OK to disagree; it's not OK to insult another poster.
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  9. #24
    Senior Member chomp's Avatar
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    I'm confused by the pro-snowshoe crowd claiming that the postholers have a "Me, Me, Me" attitude. Isn't the pro-snowshoe argument something like "Well, I don't enjoy the trail when you posthole. Therefore, you must wear snowshoes even though you don't enjoy it."

    Seems like its just a matter of preference from both sides. FWIW- I've never had a problem on a postholed trail worth complaining about.

  10. #25
    Senior Member forestgnome's Avatar
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    I often have my snowshoes on my back while ascending a broken popular trail, and I hate it! I'll wear my 36" Tubbs on a hard-packed trail if I possibly can because I like the traction and I don't like them on my back. The slightest slip of the toe drains energy. I wear shoes on Tuckerman Ravine Trail.

    If a trail is broken out with the little MSR type shoes, then only those shoes fit into the track. So it's microspikes for the climb and then off-trailing for the way down on snowshoes that float on deep snow.

    I'll never wear the MSRs because they are useless in snow. Sure, they are used to break the trail, but ususally in teams. Just because a hiker makes it to the top on fresh snow on MSRs doesn't mean they are better. You could also bareboot to the top in the same conditions if you wanted to.

    Once you are off trail on several feet of snow they are nearly worthless.

    So, if you see someone on a packed trail carrying snowshoes, don't assume they are inconsiderate. Those of us who use snowshoes that work best on snow have no choice.

    happy trails

  11. #26
    Senior Member pks4000's Avatar
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    A lot of good experiencd folks grabbed this thread.
    Thanks.
    There are so many great new winter climbers out there that a little "edu" from the old guard wont hurt.



    Postholing should only occur until you put on your flotation.
    Beyond that you are not a climber or mountaineer but a tourist.

    If you've never climbed down a steep postholed route after a new 6 inch snowfall or carried out your buddy after her knee wrenched in a "tourist's trap "(Thanks Riva Ridge) you probably will someday and then you can start the thread I just did.

    Climb onward!
    Climbing Stallion/BMT

    Whose woods these are, I think I know. His house is in the village tho. Would He not mind If I climb on, to watch His woods fill up with snow? R. Frost (paraphrased)undefined

  12. #27
    Senior Member sardog1's Avatar
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    Right now is when we could use the you-know-who and snowshoes video. I agree with the decision to remove it, but you might also agree with me that the thing was pretty funny. If the erstwhile "Melvin Kaminsky" could send up you-know-who, I guess there's room in the world for that video.
    sardog1

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    og Drykk og Tørste og det heile, som
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  13. #28
    Senior Member Bill and Sheep's Avatar
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    For me, it all comes down to doing what I can to making the trail a little nicer for the next person. It's an extension of the "leave no trace" philosophy. If I find trash on the trail, I pick it up. If I can clear a blowdown, I do. If there is a big mud hole, I get my feet wet and go through it rather than creating a new herd path. If I'm going to make a mess of a trail with boots, I put on snowshoes. I really don't see any reason the last item is any different than the other ones on my list.

    I also try to avoid getting all emotional over finding a trail not just the way I want it. I don't think people generally go out of the way to make things bad for others. It's amazing how well everything works in the Whites with minimal need to regulate things. I think we sometimes get a bit too emotional over things at the expense of just enjoying what we have.

  14. #29
    Senior Member dug's Avatar
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    If we are really concerned about making it nicer for the next guy, why stop at avoiding postholes? I'd also like to not have people all go in the same trench, could you please widen it by going at least two across, and preferably three across? This way I can possibly get a turn in for my skis.

    For those breaking the trail with snowshoes, you should also be required to wear some big, beefy, old wooden 54" snowshoes. After that first pass, smaller snowshoes should be worn. Nothing worse than having these spanky new snowshoes going first, and having the trail "broken out" with a print that isn't much bigger than a pair of sorels.

    On the steeps, please ensure you are doing your kick-steps for a person in the size range of 5'6"-6'1". Stopping at regular intervals every 200 steps, with a flat section just off the trail so I could stand and give my calves a break would be nice. And, of course, it should go without saying but I will anyway, that avoiding glissading on the way down so as to not ruin the kick steps that were just built would be nice, too.

    Next, I think that everyone breaking trail should be, at a minimum, 6'4". It doesn't make a whole helluva lotta sense to break a trail with a short person, because I may still come up behind you and hit some low-lying branches and get snow down my shirt and my bum gets cold.

    Why stop at postholes?
    Last edited by dug; 03-08-2010 at 07:34 AM.

  15. #30
    Senior Member Grumpy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sardog1 View Post
    Right now is when we could use the you-know-who and snowshoes video. I agree with the decision to remove it, but you might also agree with me that the thing was pretty funny. ...
    Amen to that! We all could use a good chuckle.

    While we're on the topic of trail use protocols, I have a question raised by the recent video on skiing down from Mt. Marcy, posted in the NY Q&A section.

    On narrow trails, how are downhill-bound skiers supposed to interact with uphill-bound traffic, and vice versa? This question probably applies to butt-sliders and sledders, as well. (I know it is traditional, although the tradition is somewhat controversial, for downbound foot traffic to yield to uphillers, but skis and sliding seem to raise some extra "control" issues for downbound traffic that complicate things.)

    Or, is this just not an issue at all?

    BTW, I much enjoyed the Mt. Marcy ski video. My own winter hiking days appear to be over, and that provided a nice, vicarious treat.

    G.

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