Energy drinks.

Often in the winter my breakfast will be a slice of left over pizza and an egg. It's terrific, and powers me up.

MR, you mentioned you cannot eat when you first get up. I don't know if that's due to a specific medical condition, but it's pretty unusual. Have you tried eating less dinner, and eating it earlier? Old proverb: Eat breakfast like a king, lunch like a prince, and dinner like a pauper. I like to eat much less in the evening, and earlier. I go to sleep hungry. It helps minimize weight gain and gerd. A side benefit is that I wake up hungry, and ready for a solid breakfast right away.

una_dogger said:

If I'm reading Mad River correctly, he isn't a fan of breakfast and relies somewhat heavily on simple carbs during his hikes. Maybe toss a couple hard boiled eggs in your pocket for the ride to the trailhead and lay off the Gatorade until the middle of your hike (just drink water until then) and see how you feel?

....

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That's about it! It is funny, two years ago I didn't have a problem with my energy level while hiking. I had a light breakfast, snacked while I hiked and had a sandwich on the summit, and I was good to go. Fast forward two years, a bout with Plantar Fasciitis, my 35 years of smoking finally catching up with me, and my knees going I find I no longer have the energy I once had. I can still do the distance, just not as fast or as pretty. In fact, it is down right ugly!

Well, if I eat that breakfast, and then do final packing, and drive ~2 hours, it's at at least 2 hours, and more like 2.5-3 before I am really starting to wind up the engine. And I wouldn't eat that breakfast and then immediately go out and race either. Eating that breakfast and then snacking most of the day does get me through a full day of hiking w/o bonking. I have that readily-available snack bottle with gorp (nuts, fruits, m&ms) and then usually some salami, pepperoni, cheese (in winter when it won't spoil). PB & fluff works well too, but I usually eat 1/2 sandwich at a time.

As for drinks, these days it is either water or Gatorade. I don't find the extra money gets me anything for higher end sports drinks. I used SmartFuel (no longer made) and before that, CytoMax, when racing, both worked well.

Tim

Perhaps you should lay off the Happy Endings before the hikes, Rick ;/)

(I'm sorry, I just read your FB status and couldn't resist)

......

Not necessarily in that order

una_dogger said:

Perhaps you should lay off the Happy Endings before the hikes, Rick ;/)

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Unfortunately, it wasn't on the menu. ;-)

Consider switching to a drink like Emergen-C which does not have any sugar in it.

hikerbrian said:

Your muscles contain enough glycogen for about 90 minutes of moderate intensity exercise, after which time you need to either supply your body with additional sources of carbohydrates, or burn other fuel sources, such as fats and proteins, which are converted to energy less efficiently than carbohydrates. Choosing not to eat before and during exercise is the surest way to an energy deficit and bonk.

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Exactly right, learned from many years of long distance marathon canoeing experience. After 15 years of Adirondack 90-Milers and multiple other northeast canoe races, and especially after racing the Yukon River Quest and twice the Yukon 1000, I have learned a lot about nutrition during constant high exercise level output maintained over an extended time period. I like to have something small and sweet on hand to pop in my mouth about every 20 minutes, then something a little more substantial at the 90-minute time, before the bonk feeling sets in. The frequent small bites seem to keep things flowing internally, otherwise my digestive system will shut down and I don't feel like eating something more substantial when I know I should. Once you bonk your efficiency is shot and it is very difficult to come back from it while still exercising.

During the Yukon races I find that fresh cherries work especially well for me, alternating with a just a bite of sausages that seem to be very popular up there. I kept an open container right next to me and don't miss more than one stroke to grab a couple. Just a cherry or two, and maybe a bite of sausage. Then I would go with a high calorie drink such as Boost or Ensure about every 90 minutes to 2 hours, with a candy bar or fig newtons and whatever else. Cherries don't keep for more than 3 days, so then I switch to apples and cheese.
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hikerbrian said:

I carry, in easily accessible pockets, string cheese, pepperoni, cookies, trail mix containing nuts, chocolate and dried fruit and marble poundcake. I eat at least a handful of something every hour, usually more often than that.

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Any of these foods are great and a variety is important over the long time. I happen to be among the small percentage of people in the world who actually like fruit cake, and I either make my own, or at this time of year buy up several bricks to freeze until summer (they might not even need to be frozen?). Break off a bite when needed and feel the energy surge. All along, proper hydration is of course just as important.

Back on solid ground I bushwhack hike the same way, usually considerably less intense, but the same techniques work just as well. Keeps me goin'.

For some reason sour-sugary (is that even a word!? ) do it for me. Nothing will perk me up faster than a small bag of Sour Skittles and following that with some water. I learned a lesson the hard way that caffeine during a hike can be a very bad thing. I was dragging ass one day this past summer and sucked down this energy drink mix that had the caffeine punch of 2 energy drinks. Well, it picked me up for a short while, but the crash (and nasty dehydration that followed) hit me very hard that it was a miracle I made it back to the road! I have forsaken caffeine while on trail since. However, previous to that, occasionally I would bring a Mountain Dew (my "energy drink" of choice for those long drives) to have on a lunch stop while hiking, but it was/is very rare, and since it does not have quite as much caffeine I usually had no problems.

Brian

Nessmuk said:

During the Yukon races I find that fresh cherries work especially well for me, alternating with a just a bite of sausages that seem to be very popular up there. I kept an open container right next to me and don't miss more than one stroke to grab a couple. Just a cherry or two, and maybe a bite of sausage.

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What's old is new again -- Pemmican.

Thinking back to my Outward Bound ski/dogsled expedition in the freezing cold Boundary Waters, we carried "squirrels bags" in our anorak's front pocket. On our big sled we hauled quite a few containers each with different high density, nutritious foods. Homemade peanut butter bars, and granola bars, cheese, nuts, dried fruits, chocolate. Each morning we would take whatever we wanted and we were encourage to nibble frequently throughout the day. Despite the fact that we burned tons of calories each day , resulting in my losing 5 lbs, I was never hungry. Easiest and most fun diet I've ever been on. We did not eat a formal lunch, only bksts and supper. We had plenty of scrumptious food. Supper was very late ... 8-11pm and bfkst about 7am.
I need to go back to following this protocol. I tend to wait until I am way to hungry and then it's very difficult to catch up. They really did emphasize small frequent snacks and we all drank lots of water. They were always checking our bottles .That was a good thing for me. Drinking enough is another problem I have because I am never thirsty. I have gotten quite ill during the summer months when I failed to keep the tank filled.

There's already been a lot of good information posted here, so perhaps I'm being redundant, but I'm a firm believer in the "snacking small and frequently" philosophy. Strive for 100-300 calories/hour, depending on your exertion rate, and if you're not eating breakfast begin taking in calories shortly after starting your hike. When exercising - especially at high intensity - most of us cannot process much more than 300 calories/hour (of course we all are different, but I've found that number pretty accurate in my case). Thus, if you eat a large meal in the middle of your hike, your body will be forced to transfer energy from your major muscles over to your digestive system - resulting in fatigue, potential stomach upset (especially if moving at a fast clip), and low energy levels.

When hiking at a slow pace, I find that carbs/fat provide sufficient fuel for me. If running, or doing an endurance sort of event, I also incorporate protein into the mix (usually in the form of an endurance fuel sports drink like Hammer Perpetuem). In the past few months I've moved towards a very clean style of eating, and as a result I'm experimenting with making my own bars and snacks. I've found that a combination of dates, nuts (usually macadamias, hazelnuts, and/or cashews), cocoa powder, coconut flakes, and raw honey produces an amazing product that's super digestible and provides excellent sustained energy.

With regards to energy drinks - I'd say ditch them. Yes, this is coming from the girl who was formerly addicted to Red Bull ! They may provide a temporary pick-me-up, but the resulting crash is just not worth it. Case in point - when Cath and I did our Hut Traverse this past summer, I was feeling awesome right up until Greenleaf Hut. When we stopped there, I downed a 5 hour energy and 2 cups of coffee. After an initial surge of energy, I crashed TERRIBLY coming down Old Bridle Path. All of the aches and pains of the day suddenly caught up to me and I became very discouraged and unhappy. It was a pretty odd experience for me, as I have a tendency towards positivity when partaking in endurance events.

Your best bet is to nail your nutrition, vs. relying on an energy drink. No one solution will work for anyone, so you may need to experiment a little - but that's always fun, too!

I also stopped drinking true "energy drinks" on or before hikes after one bad experience I had with sweating/fatigue after drinking one on the way. A cup of tea/hot chocolate in the morning before a hike is my limit now.

After the hike though, all bets are off. If a Red Bull keeps me from crashing my car on the way home at night when I'm tired after a long hike, then it was worth every penny of that $2.19.

I prefer some slightly watered down orange juice. As for snacks, jelly beans, sport gels and of course snickers. These work fine for me when I am mt biking (20-30 milers) Anything over that and I do need to stop for something more for food. always drinking just water also.

I have used same for hiking but tend to eat more solids and skip the gels.

Was reading this thread, made me remember going to the vftt vermont gathering I guess 5 years ago? Look at the middle section about when I left to go on the trip.



Many a first for me..

first time in Vermont..looked pretty driving home
first summit... Camel's hump
first time hiking in a summer rain with thunder..not to scarry but kept me thinking
first time drinking bubbly out of a bottle on a peak...got it on class mascot
first time "leaving" at 1 am to go on a trip...drank to much coffee and red bull...felt sickfirst summer gathering...very nice
first time not really sleeping the first night...tired
first time hiking with..TeeJay, Bubba, John, Stan, Periwinkle..nice folks...2nd and 3rd time with Madtownie
first time drinking Tequila at the end of a hike...excellent
first "chomp" breakfast sandwich...great
first 8% beer! but i shared it and only drank 1/2 so that's 4% right?...ok

just wanted to say i had a fun time and i dreamt about going back to Vermont to see the colors...just might have to wait until next year..will send pictures when my computer is up

After getting there I told teejay and bubba that i wasn't feeling to good, they saw what i drank, laughed at me and said "come on, we're taking you for a walk". I threw away the other 2 red bulls after that, bad crap man.

I use Boost--the diet drink. For hikes I use Boost plus which has more calories that the regular Boost. I also carry candy bars and so forth, but when it's time to eat and I'm starting to feel the need I drink a Boost. Within minutes I can feel the beneficial effect. I have also noticed that for a brief period I am also no longer thirsty. If I'm on a long hike and need more than one I space them out by an hour at least. I find I have trouble with gas pains if I take two at one time.

Update:
I did Vose Spur with friends yesterday and tried all the suggestions that were posted here:

Had a decent breakfast and had OJ and a banana on the ride to the traihead.

Made an effort to eat and drink every 15 minutes, which was extremely helpful in keeping my energy up.

During several breaks kept eating and drinking.

I drank just water for the first nalgene, then watered down the Gatorade for the rest of the hike.

During the hike I stayed in the middle of the pack. I'm too slow for the speedsters, yet faster than the slower hikers.

I had a party to go to so once we returned to Carrigain Notch Trail
from the bushwhack I headed out along. Two hikers caught me at the junction with Single Ridge, then two of us did the last 3.7 miles in an hour.

The eating and drinking throughout the hike was helpful. Before I would wait to eat on the summit.

Thanks for all your suggestions.

Cool! That's great. Good on you for being willing to try a new way of doing things, and glad it helped.

Since we are opening up the topic of overall eating.....

After a lot of personal fidgeting with my pre hike and during hike intake I have found what works for me (and again, this is what works for me and might not work for others, but I think seeing posts here sort of jives with what others are saying.) I have tried all kinds of different breakfast combinations, eating before leaving, pre-making breakfast and eating on the drive up, eating at the trailhead, so on and ad nausea. The thing I finally settled on was a decent sized breakfast (not huge, but not a couple of tiny bites and done) with a good dose of complex carbs. Complex carbs are mostly found in vegetables, which is why my preferred breakfast of choice is a plate of Alexia Waffle cut seasoned fries topped with some salsa and sour cream (for a little balance in taste) and occasionally some crumbled bacon. Now, complex carbs take longer for your system to break down and burn, which is why they are great for long term energy burning. I eat right before I leave the house to give my body time to start digesting and converting those complex carbs. While I am hiking I do like others have stated, snack small and often. I used to take one or two types of things with me (say a bag of Jerky, or trail mix and so on.) But I found quickly I would stop eating often because I was getting to the "geez, not MORE trail mix" frame of mind. So now when I go out and pick up hiking snacks I buy a big variety, at least 5 or 6, sometimes more, different kinds of snacks varying from chocolate, to sugary stuff, dry fruits and even crackers and so on. The idea is to make the snacks more simple carbs which burn faster. I think of my breakfast of complex carbs as the base of coals that fuels my fire, and the simple carb snacking is the firewood that has to be replenished often to keep the fire from dying out. Usually this arrangement is all I need, but on those hikes I know are going to be really long I will also add a sandwich or turkey/bacon/cheddar/ranch wrap.

Anyways, this is what has been working well for me for a while now. But YMMV.

Brian

First of all, I don't bother with energy drinks--the main ingredient is generally caffeine which is a stimulant, not a source of energy. Food calories are the source of energy...

NewHampshire said:

Since we are opening up the topic of overall eating.....

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I eat reasonably normally when on the trail--just continuously...

Breakfast before a hike is reasonably normal although it might be a bit larger than normal and might add some fats. (Peanut butter works well...)

Lunch is eaten more or less continuously through out the day. A large lunch requires one to stop long enough to get cold and then you have start back up with a lot of food in your stomach. Eating (and drinking) in frequent small amounts avoids this and by eating a reasonably normal mix of carbs, fat and proteins my stomach stays happy and I can eat all day. (Well, maybe some extra fats, but nothing extraordinary...)

One protocol that I have used very successfully is to stop and take a drink and snack every hour or so by my watch. This is particularly useful when doing something like XC skiing where your hands are busy. (If your hands are free you can carry food in your pockets and snack frequently.)

I learned the above for winter hiking, but it also works well for me the rest of the year too.

How and what to eat in winter has been a fairly frequent topic--here are some past threads with useful info:
* Lunch anyone? What to eat on a winter day hike http://www.vftt.org/forums/showthread.php?t=27866
* Trail Food: Dense Calories, easy to eat ? http://www.vftt.org/forums/showthread.php?t=19128
* Winter backpacking FOOD!!!!!!! http://www.vftt.org/forums/showthread.php?t=26039

Doug