6 point crampons?

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Pat T

Member
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Sep 3, 2003
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Location
North Central Massachusetts
Does anyone use 6-point crampons? I'm looking for something that I can use on ice on moderate slopes and am not sure that I really need 12-points. The salesperson at EMS recommended the 6-point ones to me. I would be carrying them with me on hikes to places like Monadonock, Noonmark, etc. I use snowshoes (MSR Denali) but think I also might need crampons.

Does anyone have an opinion on these?

Thanks!

Pat T
 
"Even on Monadnock?" Climb the White Arrow trail in winter, you might find the "Devil's Staircase" a sheet of ice and be glad to have full crampons. Remember that not only might you be hiking on ice, but also often on ice at incline. You will be glad to have a full boot crampon. Just stomp down and walk on. You won't find full crampons to be overkill. Go for them and turn yourself into an all-terrain hiker! Grivel and others make 10-points. (Grivel G-10) Remember, too, crampons can help on hard, compact snow.
Others will also concur, that snow shoes and crampons serve different purposes. For example, if you are snowshoeing in snow, but hitting ice or a slippery suface underneath, you would be better off in crampons. On the other hand, if you are post-holing with crampons, you might be doing better with snowshoes. For more on crampon use check out Papa Bear's report and pictures on his recent Osceola hike, mountain trails not unlike Monadnock's.
 
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I have an old pair of Camp 6 pointers, with the long straps and they are a pain to put on and take off. The fangs are the same size as the G10's which doesn't help much in the tripping department.
My G-10's are much easier for on and off ease. With that said, though, I am thinking about getting a pair of stabilicers for the in-between season, after seeing so many folks wearing them recently.
 
I have had the CM 6 pointers and beaten them up. I don't own a 10 or 12 pointer myself and have used the 6s around the catskills, and the local area. They work fine for the most part except for real steep inclines. Obviously, without the front points, hiking up steep icy chutes, requires a little duck walk or perhaps a little sideways (french) but I've managed OK so far.

Jay
 
I HATED my six pointers, which were Grivel, and finally gave them away with lots of warnings. I find I got better tracktion with the 6.99 four point instep crampons from k-mart - the metal squares with the corners bent up.

I didn't like them because, with the points mainly under the instep, as I rocked forward onto the ball of my foot/toes to take another forward step, the crampons would pull out of the ice. Meanwhile, the heel of the other foot would begin to come down, but not enough to engage the crampons which were further forward on the foot. That left a moment with every step where I was sliding on the toes of one foot and the heel of the other. I fell more wearing those than I did bare-booting.
 
I'm with Rambler. Full Crampons. Walk normally.

I've used both instep and full crampons for years on all kinds of ice, from flat to overhanging. I've always returned more fatigued from a trip where I used the insteps, as a result of the need to flat foot. I haven't used the 6 pointers, but I've examined them closely. They're basically just a somewhat bigger version of the 4 point instep.

There's just no substitute for normal walking. Not being able to toe-off going uphill doesn't cut it.

I will add that for hiking normal trails, you don't need aggressive front points. I think these discussions (on several threads) have gotten a little confusing sometimes when discussing front points. Really aggressive front points are only needed for technical climbing, but I still prefer a full crampon to an instep for hiking.

TCD
 
A finishing 46er posted this in his trail conditions report for his climb up Marcy last week: "full crampons a must. insteps cleats are not an option unless you like walking like a sand crab".

IMHO, Don't waste your time or money on insteps, you'll regret them. 10 or 12 points offer the most versatility and will give you much more confidence in your equipment. There are very very few occasions where I think you would actually want insteps over full crampons. This is especially true if you intend to increase your interest in winter hiking in the coming years.
 
I've spoken on another thread about Stabilicers which I think are a good early season solution where ice and rock are mixed.

But one interesting thing about their design is just the opposite of in-steps: that is there are no lugs at all under the arch. All the lugs are on the toes or on the heel. I would occasionally find myself standing on a narrow rock and was surprised to note that there were no points touching the rock. Maybe I should have been standing there on my toes rather than my instep, but that's another discussion.

Here's a picture:

210189275_400.jpg


Pb
 
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I use my 6-point Charlot Moser crampons allot, good aggressive tines. I used them on the Ammonusuc ravine steeper parts and they worked OK, you do have to walk like a crab on the sharp inclines. They work better on the way down when I need them most. The advantage in early or late season is that you can "tiptoe" over bare rocks. They're also very easy to put on.
 
I was very happy with my 6-points this past weekend on Cannon, where conditions were mixed. There were places where the grip (which was more than adequate with them) was necessary, and spots where not. Most importantly, they allowed me to get away with wearing my summer leather boots. It all worked out perfectly.

If you're experienced with crampons and are a good judge of winter-like hiking conditions, they can be the perfect tool for the inbetween days of Autumn. But they are no replacement for full 10 or 12 point crampons in a solid winter boot when the conditions warrant.
 
I used 6 point crampons last weekend. I really appreciated having them on the way to Feldspar lean-to where the terrain was pretty mixed.

I would have preferred to have a full crampon on gray and skylight where it was like following an ice road all the way up.

I have Stubai 6 points that I bought at the Loj a couple of years ago. They fit in the middle of your boot. They do seem to loosen after a while. I carry the right sized wrench with me.


-Shayne
 
Papa Bear said:
But one interesting thing about their design is just the opposite of in-steps: that is there are no lugs at all under the arch. All the lugs are on the toes or on the heel.
I just bought mine last Friday (brought it up Mt Monadnock just-in-case but didn't need it) & noticed the same thing -- note, however, that there *are* (thankfully) raised bosses on which one could conceivably install additional stud-screws. My guess would be to drill a small hole about the size of the screw shank, maybe slightly smaller (so you reduce stress on the rubber) then screw in. I wonder why they didn't put them there to start with...
 
On Seymour and Seward this weekend my son and I had 10 pointers with front points. They were a treat on the water ice and we used those front points often. The person with us had 6 (or 8) pointers that went from the instep back to the heel. He made it up and down but with some difficulty. He had to keep his heels on the ground on the steep terrain and was green with envy at how well ours performed. I don't regret a cent.
 
arghman said:
I just bought mine last Friday (brought it up Mt Monadnock just-in-case but didn't need it) & noticed the same thing -- note, however, that there *are* (thankfully) raised bosses on which one could conceivably install additional stud-screws. My guess would be to drill a small hole about the size of the screw shank, maybe slightly smaller (so you reduce stress on the rubber) then screw in. I wonder why they didn't put them there to start with...
Arghman

I think it was done on purpose. I had no problems walking anywhere - ice or rock - and I only noticed it when I happened to be standing on a pointy rock. They are comfortable walking over rocks and more lugs might be counterproductive.

If you do put in more lugs, let us know what it does to the performance.

Pb
 
I have Atlas 6 pointers that look like a snowshoe crampon. Great when you have patchy ice because your heel can be free to walk on rock. Since they only cover the front of the boot, I find I only use them early or late in the season and use 10pt the rest of the time.
 
Hey, great photos of those Stabilicers, Papa Bear. I used my early edition (missing velcro tape parallel with toe) of these items this past weekend on the Osceola's, Tecumseh, the southern Presi's, and Liberty/Flume, and they were the ticket. However, I have now popped out 8 of the 17 screws on one shoe and 2 on the other; many others screw heads are now quite worn, after six days of hard use the past three weeks, so I have them in "the shop" for some repairs at the moment.
 
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