When gear goes bad...

Hi all,

Today a group of us hiking the Tripyramids ran into a man with a broken MSR snowshoe who was attempting an ambitious hike and overnight. It was one of the more expensive models with a complete steel frame and pliable deck, unlike my trusty MSRs with the molded plastic deck.

Brian and I stopped to see what we could do to help and the fracture of the crampon was a catastrophic failure. The steel base plate of the snowshoe's crampons had apparently cracked and as a result the middle section was missing. In essence, this hiker's foot was no longer connected to the snowshoe. We offered zip-ties and a few less than optimum suggestions but it was clear the snowshoe was trashed.

This hiker did not want to disappoint his friends and decided to continue on with one shoe on and microspikes on the other foot. I finally voiced my concern and urged the hiker to turn back before night fell.

This incident got me thinking about how much faith I put in my gear. Recently a man from Maine needed to be rescued from Lafayette when his snowshoe broke and he found himself in waist deep snow. It was a real reality check for me.

What are your thoughts?

Z

Had to repair a broken discount store snow show for somebody last week with the pull ties off the zippers of my pack. I had a pair of old school Raichle leather boots I wore one too many times. These boots took me all over the Whites to the Rockies and Sierras. Tried all the new frabric/ leather boots but always came back. Wore them almost 15 years. On a 2 day pemi traverse in June the sole of the right boot tore away from the boot from the heel to the toe. After some creative use of duct tape and lacing I was on my way when a a little bit later the right one rips off around the forefoot. F'n great! Could not believe both failed. Got them to the point they were holding together but that was about it. Banged a right at the hut and beat it down the brook trail.
BTW - Now running on the LL Bean leather crestas and love them.

Sh@t happens. Some MSR users carry an extra snowshoe. If you're waist deep : shoes probably won't really make much difference. Be willing to turn back.

Chip said:

Sh@t happens. Some MSR users carry an extra snowshoe. If you're waist deep : shoes probably won't really make much difference. Be willing to turn back.

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That is sound advice, Chip. This person got off trail and that's why they were in waist deep snow.

thank you,

Z

Montana said:

Had to repair a broken discount store snow show for somebody last week with the pull ties off the zippers of my pack. I had a pair of old school Raichle leather boots I wore one too many times. These boots took me all over the Whites to the Rockies and Sierras. Tried all the new frabric/ leather boots but always came back. Wore them almost 15 years. On a 2 day pemi traverse in June the sole of the right boot tore away from the boot from the heel to the toe. After some creative use of duct tape and lacing I was on my way when a a little bit later the right one rips off around the forefoot. F'n great! Could not believe both failed. Got them to the point they were holding together but that was about it. Banged a right at the hut and beat it down the brook trail.
BTW - Now running on the LL Bean leather crestas and love them.

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Man, that's a heck of a time to blow two tires. Nice use of duct tape by the way. You know what they say, "If you can't duck it, _____ it!"


Z

Chip said:

Sh@t happens... Be willing to turn back.

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What Chip said. You can know and care for your gear, you can carry repair supplies. But short of carrying and EMS outlet in your pack...

Some MSR users carry an extra snowshoe...

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I know this is OT, but being in the market for a new pair of snowshoes, I've been searching the forum for reviews/commentary on various models and I've come across a LOT of posts about MSR's breaking for failing for one reason or another - far more than other 'shoes. Is it just that they're that much more common or popular that they seem to break more frequently? If I had to keep sending snowshoes back to the manufacturer for repair and replacement, I'm not sure I'd want to deal with them, great customer service or no.

summitseeker said:

That is sound advice, Chip. This person got off trail and that's why they were in waist deep snow.

thank you,

Z

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The rescue requirement was not due to the busted snow shoe, but due to the individual getting lost, and probably a lack determination to solve their own problem. A busted snow shoe should not mandate a rescue, you just need to work harder to get your self out. As for the original question, you need to be prepared to turn around in the event of key equipment failure. Most equipment failure is preventable by checking it regularly and testing it before heading out. In the case electronic gadgets, understanding their limitations.

griffin said:

[...]
I know this is OT, but being in the market for a new pair of snowshoes, I've been searching the forum for reviews/commentary on various models and I've come across a LOT of posts about MSR's breaking for failing for one reason or another - far more than other 'shoes. Is it just that they're that much more common or popular that they seem to break more frequently? If I had to keep sending snowshoes back to the manufacturer for repair and replacement, I'm not sure I'd want to deal with them, great customer service or no.

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I always inspect my gear before leaving and carry supplies I can use to MacGyver my way out of most situations. That said, stuff does happen and usually when it's most inconvenient, right? I just broke one of the crampon teeth on my MSR Lighting Ascents. I wrote to Cascade Designs by email asking for a replacement up-front (contrary to company policy) since the snowshoe was still usable and I was too busy working on my winter 48 to wait. Not only did they do as I asked, they sent me TWO sets: backups for my replacements! I can't say if this brand is more or less problematic than others, so I can't answer your question, but I did want to at least offer what I have. It wouldn't be too much to carry one of the crampon inserts since I have one, though it'd be necessary to carry a multitool with needle-nose pliers. Though that is hardly a solution for anyone without the spare. I, too, am interested to know if other brands fare better.

I suspect that most of us who have spent enough time hiking and backpacking over the years have had gear break down. I try to keep an eye on weak spots, but sometimes things just fail. When hiking the Long Trail, back in 2007, I had a catastrophic pack-seam disaster. Fortunately, we got to a trailhead just as the pack completely blew-out (much worse than this picture). We hitched a ride to Outdoor Gear Exchange in Burlington, VT. They gave me great customer service, and had me out the door in 30-minutes with a replacement pack. I've had the swapped out replacement pack ever since, with no problems.

That incident made me realize that having a simple, Gear First Aid kit is just as important as a First Aid kit. A needle and some dental floss would have at least slowed down my backpack's seam from falling apart. That said, the problem is that you never know what might fail or how, so it's though to plan for every situation. So you have to be ready to cobble-together the best temporary solution possible, and then get back to a trailhead before things get worse.

With regard to MSR Lightening Ascents (which I've used for quite a few years without issue), I suspect that it's a combination of (a) having more parts than something like the MSR Evo and (b) they're a popular model among people who use snowshoes frequently, and in challenging locations. Most of my regular winter hiking partners (with two exceptions) use MSR Ascents, so they seem to be a popular model. Without seeing some real data, it seems hard to say if there are any real issues with these snowshoes. I've never had or seen any issues.

jrbren said:

The rescue requirement was not due to the busted snow shoe, but due to the individual getting lost, and probably a lack determination to solve their own problem. A busted snow shoe should not mandate a rescue, you just need to work harder to get your self out. As for the original question, you need to be prepared to turn around in the event of key equipment failure. Most equipment failure is preventable by checking it regularly and testing it before heading out. In the case electronic gadgets, understanding their limitations.

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Thank you for the clarification, jrbren.

According to one article I read the hiker blamed the equipment failure for the need to seek assistance. He later made a comment alluding to the idea that he wasn't really ready for the Whites.

I too inspect my gear prior to any outing and I completely agree that mental fortitude can get you through some difficult outdoor situations. My original post was merely to began a dialogue that reflects upon how important preparation and gear can be.

Thank you for your post,

Z

griffin said:

You can know and care for your gear, you can carry repair supplies. But short of carrying and EMS outlet in your pack...

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One advantage of the old wood snowshoes is that they could be fixed in the field with a mending plate and a few screws, the bindings could be fixed with extra straps, webbing tied back together, etc. - I suppose you could fix a metal frame if you carried a heliarc welder

When the nylon strap on a Sherpa chafed through on me, I had to use shoelaces to cobble things back together much less successfully

The worst thing that happened to my snowshoes was when I was breaking deep crusty snow with new plastic snowshoes, which were allegedly designed to flex but instead both broke in half a couple miles in. I was tougher/more foolish then and used cord to tie the broken pieces on the bottom of the front pieces which cured the flexing and went on another couple miles to the summit taking perhaps 50% longer than expected. I will never use plastic snowshoes again on a serious hike regardless of what they cost.

Zip ties, sewing stuff, duct tape, hose clamps, sheet aluminum, p-cord. Stuff happens & you deal. I could fill a page with lists of what has failed, and when, and where, and how we coped.

Those MSR lightnings are a time bomb, though. Mine have failed twice. I still hike in them -- they're what I've got, and when they're working right they're great -- but the unreliability sucks.

The failure of the crampon on MSR Lightning Ascent snowshoes for me goes back to 2006. HERE is a thread from three years ago on the subject when mine finally died. Sadly, the product is not reliable for climbing in the Northeast. MSR, to their credit, has replaced hundreds if not thousands of crampons for owners--they must have a great profit margin to absorb all the returns . . . This season--after at least seven years of failures--they redesigned the crampon, separating the two points from each other. Maybe this is an improvement; let's hope so.

The Denali evo ascent, now just called evo ascent, cheaper than the unreliable Lightnings, is a great snowshoe with just the opposite durability record. In thousands of miles of use and multiple seasons (on the same terrain where the Lightnings fail) I have one crampon rivet pull out. It is a fantastic product.

JakeD said:

my Evo tours have pins held in place by split rings for the only movable part. I would like to find a replacement for that to have for repair. i bet i could email and they'd give me one

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That ring is in the repair kit they sell.

I’m on my third pair of Lightning Ascents. I finally bought any extra pair of crampons so when they go, I will just switch them out. Once I use up the extra pair, I will look for another style of snowshoe. As much as I like my Ascents, I am tired of not know when they will break. The last time they broke I was coming down the Owl’s Head slide and had to hike out in crampons.

griffin said:

What Chip said. You can know and care for your gear, you can carry repair supplies. But short of carrying and EMS outlet in your pack...



I know this is OT, but being in the market for a new pair of snowshoes, I've been searching the forum for reviews/commentary on various models and I've come across a LOT of posts about MSR's breaking for failing for one reason or another - far more than other 'shoes. Is it just that they're that much more common or popular that they seem to break more frequently? If I had to keep sending snowshoes back to the manufacturer for repair and replacement, I'm not sure I'd want to deal with them, great customer service or no.

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Hi.

I've owned the same pair of MSR Denali Classics for 13 years and have had two problems. The crampons sheared off the decking at a weak point once on Lafayette. Admittedly, i had been beating them on mixed rock and snow. I also ripped a rubber strap off one of them once. Otherwise, these snowshoes have been absolutely indestructible over somewhere in the range of 100 winter trips with them. The plastic decking cannot be broken under normal conditions. I do not believe this basic model is used anymore, but these won't need replacement anytime soon. Too bad they changed a pretty good model.

I looked at the MSR's, but just like the Atlas 1030s better. The crampons are wicked killer - the have provided some pretty outstanding traction.
I've really put a beating on these snowshoes... and aside from cosmetic wear, they work great!

But that said, I'd found that taking a roll of duct tape with some nylon rope tucked inside makes an awesome repair kit for most any situation.
Keep in mind I'm a day hiker, so most gear problems equate to frustration, but are seldom "life threatening" - day hikers seem to be the most willing to turn around... at least this one is, anyway.

JakeD said:

MSR sent me 2 new "midfoot" straps when i asked if i could buy one of the buckles. (rei garage sale. buckle missing). They sent me 2 straps and a buckle, no questions asked.

my Evo tours have pins held in place by split rings for the only movable part. I would like to find a replacement for that to have for repair. i bet i could email and they'd give me one

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My Evo Ascents have never failed in hundreds of miles of winter snowshoeing, however I have given some thought to trying to replace that pin and split ring in the cold. I took the snowshoes into a hardware store and found the largest split cotter pins I could find that would fit in the hole. I was able to put one into the snowshoe and secure it by bending the wings back with mittens on and my multitool in the comfort of my living room.

Favorite catastrophic gear failure story - one of my friends had brought a tent on an overnight that he had unwisely been using as an all-summer long hippie yurt of sorts ( against my warnings not to). We set the tent up in the early evening, and went about making dinner. It was kind of gusty, with intermittent wind blasts in the 20-30mph range. While we were settling into our meal, a bigger gust suddenly came barreling through.

The tent disintegrated before our eyes. Poof.

Suddenly all that remained of the tent ( North Face v24, what a shame), was it's impressive geodesic frame and some tattered nylon flailing in the wind.

UV degradation - it's what's for dinner.

So we went home.

The End