Article about increases use of Mt Washington in Winter

From the local papers. A good article about the increased use of the summit year round and proposed changes at the summit building.

http://www.berlindailysun.com/index...-double-edged&catid=103:local-news&Itemid=442

Based on my observations over the years, the discussion about the "deposits" left at the summit buildings door step are not neccesarily limited to the summit as it also happens at lakes and Madison Hut. Unfortunately it reinforces my feelings that there are a small minority of hikers in the hiking public that have no concept of proper behavior

There is a LARGE minority of people in New England that have no concept of proper behavior. They're forever unzipping and/or dropping trou in my near-the-turnpike neighborhood because they're too damn lazy and too inconsiderate to make it to a restroom.

And yes, I feel quite free to assert this as a regional stereotype, having lived in the Midwest, the Pacific Northwest and Alaska as well, where I virtually never saw this disgusting behavior in public places.

The presence of structures at the summit does present problems. We maintain a fire tower in the Catskills, and we have an outhouse. If we didn't, the woods all around the summit would be the outhouse. Of course, we are not above tree line, which has its own set of problems, lack of privacy not the least!

There is an expectation of 'services' wherever people go and find maintained structures. Aside from toilet issues, people ask me where the garbage can is at the summit of Balsam Lake Mountain. I tell them it's in their backpack! I go after people who throw their trash in the woods, biodegradable or not, otherwise the summit would smell like a garbage dump!

All that said, it's shameful people use the building entrances.

Human waste is not the only thing on the increase.

Wayne Presby of the Cog Railway, reported that they have a fifth diesel engine under construction. The company hopes to offer people reservations, enabling them to spend more time at the summit. The company is also revamping the track system at the summit so that trains can start up the track every 45 minutes.
Presby said that this coming year, they will try running until New Year's weekend, and if that goes well, opening weekends and holidays all winter. The Cog would not go all the way to the summit in the wintry months.
He said last year the Cog moved 80,000 people, "the most ever. . . It's been up and down but since we put the new diesel on line it has jumped 30 percent."

Seems to me that if the NH state parks is concerned about human waste on top, then park a couple of porta potties in a sheltered area up there for the winter.

Here is the agenda for that 3/29 meeting

http://www.nhstateparks.org/uploads/pdf/MWC_agenda_3-29-13.pdf

I would expect that the actual minutes will be posted in the same location, as former meeting minutes are posted there.

Breeze

I must have an odd constitution because I cannot remember the last time I took a dump in the woods while hiking including both a Presi traverse and Bond Traverse.

Peaks said:

Seems to me that if the NH state parks is concerned about human waste on top, then park a couple of porta potties in a sheltered area up there for the winter.

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Couldn't agree more -

This all worries me.

Is Mount Washington going to be the Coney Island of NH?

Call me old fashioned but between the auto road and Cog there are already enough tourists on the summit. Another train headed for the summit doesn't really enhance anyone's experience. It's a majestic mountain, not just a destination.

Z (no smiley face this time)

Peaks said:

Seems to me that if the NH state parks is concerned about human waste on top, then park a couple of porta potties in a sheltered area up there for the winter.

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I also agree. Last October when I went up Mt. Washington, the auto road was closed due to winter conditions but they left the summit building open including the restaurant, etc. It felt like a hiking community convention and they were quite busy.

While the porta potty idea is a nice thought to keep things cleaner, the logistics of keeping it clean and empty quickly become an issue when the road closes and the truck can't get up to it. I know from snowmobiling in places with remote bathrooms that in winter, an uncleaned bathroom can get pretty bad. It wouldn't take long before people would rather go behind it than in it. Plus you need to anchor it down with the wind, and who shovels it out when blocked by snow drifts?

summitseeker said:

This all worries me.

Is Mount Washington going to be the Coney Island of NH?

Call me old fashioned but between the auto road and Cog there are already enough tourists on the summit. Another train headed for the summit doesn't really enhance anyone's experience. It's a majestic mountain, not just a destination.

Z (no smiley face this time)

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Mt Washington is a lost cause. They are not going to tear out the Kanc or the AMC huts anytime soon either. So another cog train doesn't bother me at all.

I view Washington in the same light as Monadnock. You know the summit is going to be a mob scene.

sdways01 said:

While the porta potty idea is a nice thought to keep things cleaner, the logistics of keeping it clean and empty quickly become an issue when the road closes and the truck can't get up to it. I know from snowmobiling in places with remote bathrooms that in winter, an uncleaned bathroom can get pretty bad. It wouldn't take long before people would rather go behind it than in it. Plus you need to anchor it down with the wind, and who shovels it out when blocked by snow drifts?

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Portapotties would also be difficult to secure and to prevent snow from quickly filling their interiors. Perhaps consideration of the logistical issues is what prompted Mike Pelchat to suggest opening the main building. However, if fecal matter is really an issue, then providing sanitary facilities of some flavor is a no-brainer.

And, taking the position that people shouldn't be climbing Mt Washington in "wintry conditions" denies reality. On a winter blue-bird day in the Presidentials you're likely to see more people up there than on an equivalent July weekend - excluding those people who got to the top of Washington via mechanized means.

. I don't think that anyone knows the issues involving hikers and tourists on Mt Washington better than Mike Pelchat. If he thinks that expanding services on the summit is a good idea I would definitely defer to his judgement.

It could be worse. Remember the days when there was a hotel and horse coral up there? Probably not but I'm sure most have read about them. If I want solitude and majesty I will go to Jefferson or Adams. As Tom_Murphy already said, Mt Washington is a lost cause.

I think one of the biggest differences between Mt. Washington and the other summits is that the summit is so large. Try and put a building on top of Adams or Jefferson. That's obviously one of the reasons there is so much up there. But one positive thing about it is that there are places you can go and generally find some solitude. I have many times sat for a few minutes in the shelter of the building on the west side near the towers. You will see a few people coming from or heading to Lakes of the Clouds but generally it is very peaceful there as the crowd is for the most part up at the summit buildings.

Tom_Murphy said:

Mt Washington is a lost cause.

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I wonder if a North Korean missile could reach the peak? Would be a shame to lose the observatory though.

I have a vision of someone in the pottapottie, when 90 mile an hour gust comes along and sweeps the pottie off the Obs deck across the tracks and onto the slope leading into the great gulf. When the pottie fiannaly comes to rest and the door is opened, the then misfortunate ( and messy) soul states, " shit ( pun) isnt that Spaulding lake?''.

On a serious note, anyone who complaines about Washington is akin to going to the circus and complaining about the smell of elephant poop.

sierra said:

On a serious note, anyone who complaines about Washington is akin to going to the circus and complaining about the smell of elephant poop.

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I love the smell of elephant poop.

What ever happened to "leave no trace"..."carry in/carry out". We do it with our dogs! POOP...POOP...POOP...POOP...!!!!