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Thread: The Cog is in the news again for potenitally unpermitted building

  1. #31
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    I believe autoroad vans and other vehicles with handicapped authorization are allowed to pickup and discharge passengers at the summit. I think I have a photo of my 96 year old dad with folks from his assisted living facility with their van to the side taken from the summit entrance. They did not get rolled up from the parking lot as the grade is too steep for ADA even if mixing wheelchairs and summit traffic is not considered a bad idea.

    I thought of a solution similar to Toms suggestion but it causes as many problems as it solves. The 5' accessway under the trestle was reportedly not in the original concept, at the planning board meeting the lawyer for the cog mentioned that this was added to retain access for the autoroad. A five foot wide tunnel is not real wide given two way hiker and autoroad pedestrian traffic. I would expect more like 8 to 10 feet is far more acceptable. The problem with dropping the platform is that the autoroad loses the tunnel and the pedestrian traffic needs to go south into the roadway adjacent to the stage office. One major failing of the rendering on page 7 of the cog presentation is the lack of rolling stock shown which substantially increases the overall visual impact. The situation shown of people outdoors on the platform will rarely exist during the day as the cog is planning to have cars there all day . The best way to visualize the impact may be the 360 degree view on google earth https://www.360cities.net/ge_image/m...ium=all_images If you scroll to the east and imagine a row of cog cars and engines roughly the same height as the stage office all the way to the end of the abandoned track, the impact is considerably degraded views east from the summit. Given the limited access to the outer platform, its effectively become a private viewing deck for cog customers waiting to board while degrading the views of people exiting the state park building.

    When I look at the summit I see that the state park building was effectively built to service the cog with the autoroad getting the short end of the stick due the right of way arrangement in place at the time. Cog customers have a relatively sheltered short walk to the cars compared to the long exposed walk to the parking lots. There are many stories of articles of clothing heading towards Alpine Garden on windy days from autoroad customers and in general the summit experience for some on bad days is far worse for auto road customers. Hikers are unfortunately an annoying afterthought. IMHO the track extension and the addition of more rolling stock wrapping around the summit further degrades the public views from the summit.
    Last edited by peakbagger; 08-12-2019 at 02:15 PM.

  2. #32
    Senior Member TJsName's Avatar
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    So will the train platform be higher than the actual summit?
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  3. #33
    Senior Member Quietman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisB View Post
    Question: Can you park overnight in one of those lots and hike to a hut or a campsite?
    From the auto road site:

    CAN I PARK ON THE SUMMIT OVERNIGHT AND HIKE TO THE LAKES OF THE CLOUDS HUT?
    Yes. You are required to alert the attendant at the Toll House that you are going to park overnight.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by TJsName View Post
    So will the train platform be higher than the actual summit?
    Reading the print I see the 6264 foot contour line running through a granite monument near the southern end of the proposed extension. Adding 11 feet to the ground elevation yields an elevation of 6275 feet. The summit elevation is 6288. Now subtract the two and the difference between the summit and the top of the platform is 13 feet. So now we need to guess how high a cog railroad car is. Logically the car is going to be a minimum 8' clear span from the door sill. Its got a curved roof so add 2' for the roof structure. So lets use 10' from the door sill to top of the roof. So rough numbers, the top of the railroad cars will be just about 3' below the summit of Mt Washington. The actual engines are taller, so conceivably the engines cab and the stack will be higher than the summit elevation if parked on the end of the trestle.
    Last edited by peakbagger; 08-12-2019 at 08:42 PM.

  5. #35
    Senior Member CaptCaper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisB View Post
    Thanks for that link to the PDF Peakbagger. Very informative.



    I believe the Cog limits passenger time on the summit (2 hr?) . Not sure about auto road.

    One hour for Cog folks. You can stay longer but you may not get a seat or get down as the 1 hr folks have priority. And they fill up fast on busy days especially later when they want to come down. Can't imagine them leaving you up there but they put the fear of God into you. They told us we might need to walk down the auto road or call a taxi. It works for them having a order. The summit is the hardest park of the Cog's crew. Dealing with the crowds and who gets to come down first,etc. saw plenty freezing waiting in line then having to stay for the next train and freezing again from the "pecking" order they have to have for law and order. Again it works.
    The Cog is great cause many can't handle driving that funky auto road.
    Last edited by CaptCaper; 08-13-2019 at 06:17 PM.

  6. #36
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    Cog vs. Autoroad -- a microcosm of the greater battle for limited earth resources.

  7. #37
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    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons

    For those who cant handle driving the autoroad, there is always the option of taking the guided van tours. The vans also run end of day trips for those stranded at the summit.The price goes up as the hour gets later.
    Last edited by peakbagger; 08-14-2019 at 04:58 AM.

  8. #38
    Senior Member ChrisB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peakbagger View Post
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons

    ...the vans also run end of day trips for those stranded at the summit.The price goes up as the hour gets later.
    Wow, demand pricing!! How hip.

    Sounds like a great opportunity for a local climber moonlighting as an Uber /Lyft driver.
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  9. #39
    Senior Member dave.m's Avatar
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    All of this makes me want to climb Adams. Or West Bond.
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  10. #40
    Senior Member ChrisB's Avatar
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    ... the argument that free access and unrestricted demand for a finite resource ultimately reduces the resource through over-exploitation, temporarily or permanently. This occurs because the benefits of exploitation accrue to individuals or groups, each of whom is motivated to maximize use of the resource to the point in which they become reliant on it (Obs, Auto Road, Cog), while the costs of the exploitation are borne by all those to whom the resource is available (which may be a wider class of individuals than those who are exploiting it).

    So where do we hikers fit in this scenario? Exploiters or "those to whom the resource is available?"
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  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisB View Post
    ... the argument that free access and unrestricted demand for a finite resource ultimately reduces the resource through over-exploitation, temporarily or permanently. This occurs because the benefits of exploitation accrue to individuals or groups, each of whom is motivated to maximize use of the resource to the point in which they become reliant on it (Obs, Auto Road, Cog), while the costs of the exploitation are borne by all those to whom the resource is available (which may be a wider class of individuals than those who are exploiting it).

    So where do we hikers fit in this scenario? Exploiters or "those to whom the resource is available?"
    Based on the number of TP blooms in the Spring at the summit, Madison hut, and LOC Hut...exploiters

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom_Murphy View Post
    Based on the number of TP blooms in the Spring at the summit, Madison hut, and LOC Hut...exploiters
    Could be worse. Could be overflowing barrels of excrement.

    oh, wait...

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