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Thread: Moat Mountain Hiker Rescue

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    Senior Member Grey J's Avatar
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    Its a great loop. I did this hike last year and loved it. But to state the obvious, a 3:30 pm start is poor planning.
    "I am a pilgrim and a stranger"

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    Senior Member ChrisB's Avatar
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    Interesting. Sounds as if the hikers were content to spend the wet night and find their way in the morning, but a family member called in the rescue for them.

    Once again an "if we are over-due" plan might have spared F&G the trouble.
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    Senior Member skiguy's Avatar
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    I wonder if they were using real ponchos or Sears ponchos? Kudos to them for being able to make their own shelter. I don't think many trampers actually carry or use ponchos much anymore. Personally I think they are a great tool. Not sure exactly where they were lost. Not that I condone such a late start but the area below Red Eagle Ridge can be confusing. Not the first and probably won't be the last to get lost in that area. The convergence of hiking trails, mountain biking trails and Forest Roads makes for interesting route finding for the uninitiated. Joey Bag a Donuts is here for the Summer.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grey J View Post
    Its a great loop. I did this hike last year and loved it. But to state the obvious, a 3:30 pm start is poor planning.
    The news article refers to an estimated 3-4 hour hike, leaving at 3:30 pm. They should have been back before dark. Is that time estimate correct for that loop?

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    Quote Originally Posted by jfb View Post
    The news article refers to an estimated 3-4 hour hike, leaving at 3:30 pm. They should have been back before dark. Is that time estimate correct for that loop?
    It was unclear to me which route they took as both a traverse and loop can use the same named trails and are of similar length. Either way, you're looking at a bit shy of 3000 feet in elevation gain. I think 3-4 hours would be on the optimistic side.

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    Senior Member jniehof's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jfb View Post
    The news article refers to an estimated 3-4 hour hike, leaving at 3:30 pm. They should have been back before dark. Is that time estimate correct for that loop?
    Assuming this is the South-Middle Moat traverse (which would fit), book time is 5:45. I would expect even pretty fit teenagers from NYC to have a hard time going faster than book on this, unless they got out of the city quite a bit very regularly. 3 hours is getting into trail running territory (although I'm sure somebody's done it in under two).

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    Senior Member Grey J's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jniehof View Post
    Assuming this is the South-Middle Moat traverse (which would fit), book time is 5:45. I would expect even pretty fit teenagers from NYC to have a hard time going faster than book on this, unless they got out of the city quite a bit very regularly. 3 hours is getting into trail running territory (although I'm sure somebody's done it in under two).
    Yeah, I went back and read the story and this is not the North Moat/Red Ridge loop I did. They give the distance as 8.7 miles so you're right, this is going up South Moat and traversing the ridge south to north coming down the Red Ridge Trail. They had arranged for pick up at Diana's Baths. Still think 3:30 is a late start even so close to solstice unless as you point out, we're talking about trail running.
    "I am a pilgrim and a stranger"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grey J View Post
    Yeah, I went back and read the story and this is not the North Moat/Red Ridge loop I did. They give the distance as 8.7 miles so you're right, this is going up South Moat and traversing the ridge south to north coming down the Red Ridge Trail. They had arranged for pick up at Diana's Baths. Still think 3:30 is a late start even so close to solstice unless as you point out, we're talking about trail running.
    I'll agree that a 3:30 start is too late for that hike, unless they decided to watch the sunset from the summit and hike down in the dark (something I might do).

  10. #10
    Senior Member Mike P.'s Avatar
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    Glad they got out okay, evidently it was too late of a start for their ability. We won't find out what their research was, likely was not the WMG as others pointed out the book time was 5 hours and 45 minutes. What kind of panchos would be interesting, typically, I see them more as a cheap covering than the higher end ones. They do allow for a bit better shelter than trying to take a jacket and make a shelter with it.

    I remember early on joining this site many years ago, you had to read trail condition reports from many and see who did hikes roughly the same as you did. Some people would turn around at the sign of the first clouds, some would crawl to summits in horrible tempests. Some people say an all day hike is five or six miles, some regularly do 25 - 30 mile trips. If a 10 mile hike takes someone 3-4 hours and if they ignore the 2500 or 3000 feet of elevation gain and you get winded climbing a couple flights of stairs, there is a big disconnect there.
    Have fun & be safe
    Mike P.

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