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Thread: Reckless Hikers Pay "Penalty"

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    Reckless Hikers Pay "Penalty"

    Two "hikers" got plucked off the rocks in Franconia area and were convicted of reckless conduct. Fine: $248 ($200 fine plus a $48 assessment). That seems laughably small for the effort. Not sure what kind of message that is sending. Story here: https://www.wcax.com/2022/09/06/2-hi...-notch-rescue/

    Facebook post from PVSAR had a bit more details.

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    Its stings when someone gets slapped on the wrist

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    Senior Member skiguy's Avatar
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    Probably cost more to heat the water to make the wet noodle.
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    Our phasing out of public pillories was not a completely positive step. I'm not saying throwing actual rocks. Necessarilly.

    Actually, we are reasonably restrained here and even sometimes constructive in drawing lessons rather than taking the opportunity to display our superiority. This was a more general social media observation rather than forum-specific.
    Last edited by Will; 09-06-2022 at 08:06 PM.

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    Moderator bikehikeskifish's Avatar
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    I have to repeat this almost every time the subject comes up. Remember that...

    Negligence when hiking is covered for costs incurred if a rescue is needed providing the rescued party has a hikesafe or other F&G card (license, boat registration, etc.) - there is no fine.

    Recklessness when hiking negates the hikesafe or other card and the recued party can be liable for costs incurred in their entirety.

    Recklessness is also an offense under NH RSA laws and as such carries a fine which ranges depending on the nature of the offense.

    What was levied here is the the fine for recklessness. They may still well receive a bill for costs incurred.

    Tim
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    Senior Member ChrisB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DayTrip View Post
    Two "hikers" got plucked off the rocks in Franconia area and were convicted of reckless conduct. Fine: $248 ($200 fine plus a $48 assessment). That seems laughably small for the effort. Not sure what kind of message that is sending. Story here: https://www.wcax.com/2022/09/06/2-hi...-notch-rescue/

    Facebook post from PVSAR had a bit more details.
    I find it interesting they are characterized as "hikers." The linked article states they had "No hike planned" or something to that effect.

    Maybe they really were bushwhackers, or boulderers, or free ascentionists.

    Why give the hiking community a black eye in this fiasco? (Same applies to tram riders who decide to walk down.)
    Don't let your mind write a check your body canít cash

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    Quote Originally Posted by bikehikeskifish View Post
    I have to repeat this almost every time the subject comes up. Remember that...

    Negligence when hiking is covered for costs incurred if a rescue is needed providing the rescued party has a hikesafe or other F&G card (license, boat registration, etc.) - there is no fine.

    Recklessness when hiking negates the hikesafe or other card and the recued party can be liable for costs incurred in their entirety.

    Recklessness is also an offense under NH RSA laws and as such carries a fine which ranges depending on the nature of the offense.

    What was levied here is the the fine for recklessness. They may still well receive a bill for costs incurred.

    Tim
    Understood. I'm just saying that if the purpose of a fine is to discourage unwanted behavior I don't think $200 is going to discourage much behavior. I don't think even the people in question are disputing their reckless behavior. Kind of a slam dunk case and yet the penalty is fairly small. That was probably more than offset by administration, court costs and other expenses to process. So why bother? You're not sending a message that discourages the behavior and you aren't recovering any money (pending possible rescue bills as you note).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Will View Post
    Our phasing out of public pillories was not a completely positive step. I'm not saying throwing actual rocks. Necessarilly.

    Actually, we are reasonably restrained here and even sometimes constructive in drawing lessons rather than taking the opportunity to display our superiority. This was a more general social media observation rather than forum-specific.
    If that is some veiled attempt to suggest this post is inappropriate and that I am somehow asserting some sense of superiority I would respectfully disagree. If that was your intention just go ahead and slap me across the face with a glove or something and snarl "How dare you!".

    By their own admission the hikers in question said they were reckless and I have made no commentary about their skills, intentions, equipment, etc. My point is that the apparent fine for reckless behavior in NH is not very large and will not discourage reckless behavior. This topic has come up countless times on this forum (as Tim alluded to in his post) so I'm guessing people find it relevant. I don't recall a specific rescue mentioned before that had an actual conviction and fine amount, but I have not been on this forum nearly as long as others so maybe I have missed such a post. I found the size of the actual $$ amount for the fine relevant.

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    Senior Member Grey J's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisB View Post
    I find it interesting they are characterized as "hikers." The linked article states they had "No hike planned" or something to that effect.

    Maybe they really were bushwhackers, or boulderers, or free ascentionists.

    Why give the hiking community a black eye in this fiasco? (Same applies to tram riders who decide to walk down.)
    I had the same reaction. Hikers? These guys are not "hikers." I thought at first that maybe they were rock climbers, but no they were not that either. I liked "free ascensionists." Whatever label applies, they were certainly "reckless" and indisputably clueless and probably should just stay home and play video games so they don't put other people at risk trying to extricate them.
    "I am a pilgrim and a stranger"

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    If that is some veiled attempt to suggest this post is inappropriate and that I am somehow asserting some sense of superiority I would respectfully disagree
    We are reasonably restrained here and even sometimes constructive in drawing lessons rather than taking the opportunity to display our superiority. This was a more general social media observation rather than forum-specific.
    Last edited by Will; 09-07-2022 at 11:42 AM.

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    Senior Member nartreb's Avatar
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    For anyone else who was wondering, "Hounds Hump" is the rounded, cliffy peaklet adjacent to Eagle Cliff, i.e., overlooking the bottom of the Greenleaf Trail. Climbers sometimes visit that area; in particular, "the Eaglet", a small free-standing spire on the southerly face, makes for some very nice photos.

    https://cdn2.apstatic.com/photos/cli...1494327564.jpg

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    Senior Member Mike P.'s Avatar
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    Hopefully they pay some costs also, however, stupidity is not a crime. They were not too difficult to find, and the weather was nice. Hopefully they will pay the fine themselves and not ask their folks for the money. If getting out of your car and walking in Franconia Notch makes you a hiker than I guess if I sit in a police car makes me a trooper.
    Last edited by Mike P.; 09-12-2022 at 02:01 PM.
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    Senior Member maineguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike P. View Post
    I guess if I sit in a police car makes me a trooper.
    Or a suspect

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    Senior Member Mike P.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by maineguy View Post
    Or a suspect
    Rule one: Don't get caught. Okay, I should have said in the front seat.
    Have fun & be safe
    Mike P.

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