catskill peaks (nay), catskill trails (yea)

The views from the top in the catskills pale in comparison to the adk's. There are no bald peaks with 360 degree views, only "lookouts". no slides to give the mountains definition. they are usually so far apart they look like hills.
Big hills, but hills. But, her comes the good part. The trails themselve are great. Rock formations, waterfalls and creeks. In the adk's I usually put my head down and grind it out untill I get to the reward at the summit. Also the names (west kill, mink hollow, diamond notch). Great names, I have become a fan of the catskills.

They are what they are. To me, it's like apples and oranges trying to compare the Catskills to the Dacks or the Dacks to the Whites. Different ranges formed by different geological events are bound to be strikingly different from one another. As I surmise you know, the Catskills don't even technically fit the definition of mountains. They are a plateau uplift of sedimentary rock caused by the runoff of the ancient Acadian range.

Anyhoo, I love 'em too ... the endless rolling green hills that a good lookout provides. Someone a long time ago (Thomas Cole, I think) said the views in the Catskills were as fine as any the Adirondacks had to offer. Personally, I've always tried to envision myself walking on the ocean floor as I hike through the Catskills. It's all a matter of perspective.

The other Mark S did a good job describing the differences, and viva la difference!

The Upside of the Catskills:
The trails and camp sites are less crowded.
The bears are not aggressive (except near settled areas and large campgrounds).
There are more open woods to bushwhack through.
The terrain is easier to read and it is harder to get lost (IMHO).
The numbers of biting bugs are less than the other northeast mountains.
Mud season is generally not as bad because of thin, sandy soils.
The forests are predominately hardwoods which is nice in the autumn, although with less reds than the northern mountains.

The horizontal Catskill rock strata explains why there are so few slides. The soil cannot slide off as easily as it does on the slanted bedrock of the Adirondacks. The few Catskill slides are loose rock slides on very steep slopes. These can be more painful to climb compared to those smooth slanted sidewalks in the Adirondacks. The Friday Mt slide is probably the most fun with nice views. The older Slide Mt slide is now overgrown, and reportedly a painful walk on loose rock.

There are many fine views, often not right at the summits, e.g. Buck Ridge on Westkill, the two meadows on Ashokan High Point and its lower summit, the cliffs on Overlook, Huckleberry Point, Dibble's Quarry (with rock furniture) on Sugarloaf, Palenville Overlook (more rock furniture), Indian Head (aka Profile Rock), Poet's Ledge, the many viewpoints on the Escarpment Trail around North and South Mts. The views can be hazy, and its usually a view of more rounded green mountains rather than craggy peaks.

Because the Catskills have been more settled than the Adirondacks there are lots of interesting place names, e.g. Elfin Pass, Goblin Gap, Devil's Pulpit, Devil's Kitchen, Hell Hole, Alligator Rock, Sphinx Rock, Cod Fish Point, Fawn's Leap, Naiad's Bath, Niobe Falls, Rumble Tumble Falls, Peekamoose, Bangle Hill, Giggle Hollow, Barkaboom, Bullet Hole (two of them), Cradle Rock Ridge.

The Catskills are just plain fun to hike.

Stop Stop Stop!

Mark and Mark, you guys have to stop spreading the good word about the Catskills or else everyone will come. Then we'll have the same crowds and crazed bears as the ADKs. I cringe when I see articles about the Cats in magazines. This is suposed to be our secret shangrela... shussshhhhhhhhhh, not another word out of you Cats hikers, YA HEAR ME?

paul ron said:

This is suposed to be our secret shangrela... shussshhhhhhhhhh, not another word out of you Cats hikers, YA HEAR ME?

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and the catskills still have summit canisters - plus the 3500 club has hikes every weekend to help you find them (anyone needing info on 3500 club hikes can e-mail me).

Who needs bears when you have places overrun with Porcupines... case in point, The Batavia Kill leanto.. Guinness the Porcupine Hunter, Tmax, and I spent a night friday at this particular leanto to be witness to a frontal assualt on the leanto WHILE we were inside it trying to sleep. Gnaw Gnaw Gnaw on the wood... "I'd rather have bears" said Guinness before grabbing a trekking pole and literally poking one of the offending varmints in the rump who was gleefulling ensconced in the firepit eating the frikkin ashes of our campfire.. Have you ever seen a porcupine run? Well it was entertaining to say the least. Not their usual waddle.

anyway, after that, I think Guinness put fear in their minds and the assult wore thin.

Then when we saw one on the viewpoint on Blackdome, we thought they were following our sweat trail...

Jay

am i recollectin' rightly? is the catskills where my favorite book of all time "my side of the mountain" takes place? yeah, it is. do yourself a favor, read it now.

Adk_dib said:

The views from the top in the catskills pale in comparison to the adk's. There are no bald peaks with 360 degree views . . .

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I know what the name of this site is, but really, I can't be the only one who does not judge a mountain largely on it's "view" - as if a mountain could have only one view. Even if you want to talk views, I'm more interested in the view of the mountain itself, not the view from the mountain.

It is nice to see note of the cool rock formation, creeks and waterfalls along the trail. But I'd say these belong to the mountain. And so do the wildflowers, the owls, the fishers, and all the other cool stuff there is to see.

I don't mind looking 360 degrees from the top of a mountain, but it is way down my list of the coolest things out there, and the reasons to go hiking.

"Porcupines, the meal that comes with it's own tooth picks" is what an old freind says. They are something else up there and especially at the Batavia Lean-to.

I am huge fan of the Catskills!!! Two summers ago I did the loop - which is Wittenberg, Slide and Cornell (all on the 3500). I live in S. Jersey so this is the closest thing I have until I get to NH or north of there. But the views in comparison to what I've seen in VT and NH are very comparable...the journey up is 1/2 the fun We try to get up there once every couple of months for a killer hike!

Let me know if anyone will be up that way 4th of July weekend. I plan on doing Wittenberg and some other trails...

I concur with all the above posts. For me the woods seem "friendlier" in the Catskills and encourage off the trail exploration - except for those darn stinging nettles (ouch!).

Oh wait... the Catskills are a waste of time. Just a bunch of mole hills with no good views. Keep driving another three hours to the high peaks.

bruno said:

am i recollectin' rightly? is the catskills where my favorite book of all time "my side of the mountain" takes place? yeah, it is. do yourself a favor, read it now.

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Wow, I completely forgot about that book! That was my absolute favorite when I was a kid. And I believe you're right; it did take place in the Catskills.

Adk_dib said:

The views from the top in the catskills pale in comparison to the adk's. There are no bald peaks with 360 degree views, only "lookouts".

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It's not 'bald', but the view from the Hunter fire tower is 360 degrees for sure!

Tom Rankin said:

It's not 'bald', but the view from the Hunter fire tower is 360 degrees for sure!

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Not the day I did it, they weren't!

Every summit has a 360° view... Just some of them kind of have trees in the way

Jay

The Catskill ARE mountains.

Mark S wrote:

"As I surmise you know, the Catskills don't even technically fit the definition of mountains. They are a plateau uplift of sedimentary rock caused by the runoff of the ancient Acadian range. "

I am curious as to the "technical definition" you are referring to.

My online dictionary reads:

moun·tain ( P ) Pronunciation Key (mountn)
n.
Abbr. Mt. or Mtn. A natural elevation of the earth's surface having considerable mass, generally steep sides, and a height greater than that of a hill.

A large heap: a mountain of laundry.
A huge quantity: a mountain of trouble.

Mount Everest is uplifted sedimentary rock. You can see the bands of rock in most photos, the yellow band being the most notable. This does not mean that Everest is not a mountain. Just like the Catskills, the Himalayas are a product of uplifted and eroded sedimentary rock.

Mike

Well, Mark S is saying that unlike the Himilayas (and Everest) formed by the collision of two tectonic plates (the Indian subcontinent and that from Tibet/China), the catskills as well as the Berkshires, the Taconics was one long plateau some 17k' ASL.. Eventually the rivers, beds, water (since it was underwater too at some point) would erode the sandstone and various levels until it became what we now know as the catskills. Obviously, the Hudson River being the largest river, it has carved out quite a big valley between the Berkshires and the Catskills but it was all one long flat plane.

So, unlike Everest which, due to plate tectonics, is slowly rising, the catskills are slowly shrinking. Much like the rest of the appalachian chain of mtns.

Jay

a little of both....

The Himalayas are shrinking, as they are eroded, yet their tectonic plate still lifts them higher. While we can be sure that the Cats are also being eroded down, I don't know that they are not being uplifted higher from below as well.
The point (and I am just being like a protective parent of my beloved mountains) is that just because the Cats are layers of uplifted sedimentary rock, that doesn't preclude them from being mountains; and in this way they are similar to the Himalyas.

This definition stuff is kind of silly. Yet I have to step in when someone wants to say that they are not REALLY mountains.

lovemycatskillMOUNTAINS

Mike

Alright, this has gone on long enough. There are no positives concerning the Cats. Must be true since so few people go there compared to the real mountains. All y'all can just keep on driving past these little things.

I'll make the sacrifice and keep checking them out for everyone else and will let you know if I find something worth stopping for.

Tony

rondak46, Yes, that is what I meant, every molehill and mountains are being eroded so every hill is always getting shorter. But from what I've read, (I'm no geologist) everything that I've read on the catskills mentions the eroded plateau, the catskills delta, etc. etc. the work of glaciers and the two river basins (delaware and the hudson) the catskills divide, etc. etc.

Of course, the whole appalachian range can be more described as hills too, not to take anything away from them. From somebody working on the catskills hundred highest (More than halfway through!), you can probably guess where my loyalty lies.

Jay