PRODUCT WARNING - Bear Vault

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WalksWithBlackflies

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Funny... two minutes after reading Pete's thread, I received this message from the supplier where I bought my Bear Vault:

Product Warning

If you use a BearVault or Bearikade, or know somebody that does please pass this on. For the last two weeks approximately 7 BearVaults and 2 Bearikades have been broken into by a bear in a specific area of the Sierra. At this time these incidents are isolated to this specific area and possibly one or more bears. The Sierra Interagency Black Bear Group has pointed out that at this time this does not affect the approval status of any BearVault models. The local rangers will attempt to tag the suspected bear(s) and observe its behavior during interactions with bear canisters put in the area to observe what is happening. BearVault is obtaining several of the canisters from the incidents in this area in an effort to determine the cause of the failures.
 
Holy crap! Thanks for the info, Rico. (Keeping a mental note for next summer when I'm supposed to do Mt. Whitney...)
 
Thanks for the heads up. Sierra bears are light-years ahead of north eastern bears in their skills at breaking into cannisters. I think we will be alright in the NE for a while longer. (Just don't go sending any of our NE bears to Sierra U.)

Doug
 
Time and time again, the Sierra bears are the first to "crack the code" of food storage methods. :eek:

Here is a link to Approved Canisters

The Bear Vault only has a screw-on lid, while the Bearikade has a screw type latch system and lid which overlaps the rim. This is easier for bears to lock jaws onto.

Meanwhile the model Garcia Backpacker 812-C is the primary keg as rented by the National Park Service in Yosemite. This design has recessed screw latches which need a coin or knife edge to turn screws.

Hopefully they won't learn this soon! :rolleyes:
Brownie
 
An observation,

The rationale behind the regulation to require cannisters was the ADK bear had figured out how to thwart the old bear bag.

It seems Yogi's western cousins have figured out how to thwart the cannister. How long before the Northeast bears figure this out?

I read the logic behind all of this was once the bears learn they cannot get food from the cannisters they will be less of a problem to campers.

This bit of news from the Sierra suggest just the opposite. At some point the bears will master the cannisters like they did the ropes.

Just musing the logical progression and wondering if Yogi isn't smarter than the politicians that dream up these regulations?
 
HTML:
AntlerPeak wrote: An observation,

The rationale behind the regulation to require cannisters was the
 ADK bear had figured out how to thwart the old bear bag.


It seems Yogi's western cousins have figured out how to thwart the
 cannister. How long before the Northeast bears figure this out?

I read the logic behind all of this was once the bears learn they cannot get
 food from the cannisters they will be less of a problem to campers.


This bit of news from the Sierra suggest just the opposite. 
At some point the bears will master the cannisters like they did the ropes.


Yes that is correct.
We can look at what’s happening in the Sierras as a preview of what is to come elsewhere.
In particular, the Yosemite bears are the most efficient learners of the "trade".
Hanging bear bags are a thing of the past and now jokingly called the "Yosemite Piñata” ;)

Brownie
 
The politicians are smarter indoors, where they dine on "expense accounted gruel" (apologies to Jethro Tull). The bears are far smarter outdoors, where they know everything, and the politicians don't know jack squat more than a cub scout.

Of course California is a leading indicator of what will happen in the East in a few years. The Sierra solution, which works well, is lockable permanent vaults at camp sites. NY State Government is unalterably opposed to these. Probably because they would actually have to DO something and spend money, not just pat themselves on the back for telling everyone else to do something and spend money.

It will all come around in the end.

TCD
 
Going to the Sierras next week

Hmmmm this is troubling. My wife and I are doing the high route in Kings Canyon next week (9 days backpacking, should be fun...) with the Sierra Club. They are supposed to issue us all Sierra Club Bear Canisters.

What would you guys do given this...just go and hope for the best? Buying one of the bettter ones unlikely to help as the 9 other people (carrying a part of my food) will have the vault.

Any article someplace I could forward to our trip lead?
 
I have a BV-300 that I purchased this year (with the new lid).

For the cost per weight, its a good product. I was able to keep 8 days of food in it barely for a trip to Wrangell St. Elias.

I can't truly comment on the effectiveness because I wasn't exactly in prime bear country in Wrangell. I spent the whole 9 days above tree line with no signs of recent bear activity other than really dried up bear scat.

However, I did find failure with the screw type lid in that it was too easy to overtighten the lid such that no amount of hand force could get the thing open. Fortunately, it has little ribs in the lid and I was able to use my pocketknife screw and a rock to chisel the cover loose. Happened twice when I was in Wrangell. I exchanged it at the REI in anchorage w/o a problem. Kept having to remember to don't sit on the canister and turn clockwise (like when viewing scenery or wildlife) or else it would overtighten...

I exchanged it cause one of my chisel events, I put a small crack in the lid.

Jay
 
Bluethroatedone said:
Hmmmm this is troubling. My wife and I are doing the high route in Kings Canyon next week (9 days backpacking, should be fun...) with the Sierra Club. They are supposed to issue us all Sierra Club Bear Canisters.

What would you guys do given this...just go and hope for the best? Buying one of the bettter ones unlikely to help as the 9 other people (carrying a part of my food) will have the vault.

Any article someplace I could forward to our trip lead?

Where EXACTLY are you going in High Sierra route?
If its above 10,500 EL in Kings Canyon, then you probably don't even need a canister. Even so, the bears in that region are not the smarter Yosemite bears where this recent and isolated incident occured.
Don't worry, you will be fine.

Brownie
 
Bluethroatedone -

I copied the Product Warning word-for-word. As long as you won't be in the "specific area of the Sierra", I wouldn't worry. It doesn't seem to be a widespread problem. I just wanted to inform everyone who may be thinking of purchasing a Bear Vault (like I did two months ago). Hopefully it turns out to be an overly smart bear, and overly stupid person, or group of people who just don't know how to properly close the lid.
 
IF you are going above 10,000ft around bishops pass be aware there are plenty of bears lading up to near the top of the pass. The Palisade reigon is the most alpine area in the range amd predators tend to be found at the higher elevations.
 
Bluethroatedone said:
We'll be above 10,000 ft quite a bit I think. (We hit it on day 2). Don't know how well you know the are but we are doing: "from Road's End, deep in the canyon of the South Fork Kings River and up, over five alpine cols into remote Lake Basin"

http://www.sierraclub.org/outings/national/brochure/05162A.asp

WOW! I am soo jealous. You are signed up for a super fantastic trip!
The High Sierra Route from that location or any other is a sight to behold.
I have done the section near the end of your trip from Upper Basin to Mather Pass on to Palisade Basin. However I did it from north to south.
The southern regions from South Fork of Kings River will most certainly be in bear country, but not the ones mentioned farther north in Yosemite.
Soon enough you will be on very high ground with little or no trees in sight.
Generally out of bear country completely.

You will climb the famous Snow Tongue Pass which was an early explorer's conquest to get into the High Lake Basin and deep Sierra country. A Very historical feat accomplished by the US Geological Society.
Most of your trek will NOT be on maintained trails but rather open crosscountry travel, my favorite!
Have fun and post a full report when you return!

Brownie
 
NOW I remember why I bring that guy pictured to the left, and why I tolerate the mud being tracked into the tent. He and his predecessors have kept the campsite 100% ursine-free for more than 25 years, including a couple of occasions when a merely sleepless night might otherwise have devolved into something far less pleasant.

And you don't have to own one of the herding or guarding breeds. Read Steinbeck's Travels With Charley for an amusing "New York poodle meets bear" tale.
 
Update

Bear Vault added some additional info on another hiking forum, which I've copied:

We have updated our web site to link to the official letter that was sent out by the SIBBG. The link is
http://www.bearvault.com/bearvault_productnotices.php
We have no more information at this time than what is in the letter. The letter does point out that at this time both canisters are still SIBBG approved

Bluethroatedone - you will definitely want to check out the official letter on the provided link.
 
Here are some excerpts from a trip report of someone who was just in the Yosemite area (http://forums.backpacker.com/thread.jspa?threadID=69066&tstart=25). I've highlighted the updates of the Bear Vault "problem":

On August 1, 2005, at our Yosemite Valley, California, backpacking campsite, other campers warned our group of five that a large bear had just come in and ate their peanut butter in a jar on their picnic table while they were seated at the other end of the table. The bold bear did not leave the table until it finished all the peanut butter. We locked up all our food in the provided steel bear lockers and went to sleep. At 4:00 a.m., G-Force heard a campsite bear locker being rattled as if someone was removing an item from inside. At 4:30 a.m., our steel bear locker was noisily jimmied open and the contents were tossed aside in quite a rude manner. Our party woke up, and discovered a large bear had opened the mechanism somehow, and was going through some of our food that was inside the locker but outside our bear canisters. Jerry quickly ran naked from his tent and yelled at the bear to scare it away as the Park Rangers suggested we treat these habituated bears. Instead of running, the marauding bear turned on Jerry, took 3 or 4 steps in his direction, swiped its paw horizontally in the air at Jerry, and gave a deep loud grunt. Jerry retreated back to his tent, and the bear turned back to eating our food. By this time, I had gotten my glasses on, headlamp on, bear spray our, and took off the bear spray safety clip. The bear was busily munching away on four brownies from the restaurant buffet table, and a bag of cashews, while I snuck up 15 feet directly behind the bear. I looked behind me to see if there was running room if the bear spray didn’t work, and pointed and depressed the mechanism spraying towards the bear for one second as the bear spray label suggested. The bear spray mist surrounded the bear, and the bear stayed in the cloud for one to two seconds while I started backing away. In the furthest away tent, G-Force was watching and chuckling at this whole scene, and then the bear bolted straight ahead like it had just been kicked into the butt. G-Force saw another nearby bear that I had not noticed quickly follow the sprayed bear.

I waited 15 to 20 seconds for the mist to dissipate, and then went to return the items to the steel bear locker. Unfortunately, the spray had not completely dissipated, and I inhaled a residual amount of the spray, which sent me backwards choking in pain. Bear spray is nasty stuff, and I felt sorry for the bear at that point. Several minutes later, while holding my breath, I was able to return the scattered remains to the bear locker by holding my breath. My food was completely intact in my sealed Bearakaide Bear Canister, but my canister now had bear claw scratches etched in the outside where the bear had tossed it aside to get at food behind the canister. Later that day I made a complete report to the first Park Ranger we met as the Park requires. One Park Ranger we recounted this tale to down the John Muir Trail said in 17 years of working, he had never heard of anyone spraying a bear.


We spent 20 minutes discussing this incident and a bear problem at Charlotte Lake with Ranger George on day 19. The Ranger was warning us of a problem bear that was opening the bearvault canisters by depressing the top until it deformed and popped off. I asked this Ranger if this bear came around our canisters (one was a bearvault), should I spray this bear too, and the Ranger said "yes".


Apparently some bears have swatted a canister over a cliff, and ate the contents after the canister shattered. Our bearikades recommended placing the canister in a depression or is some brush. From our experiences, we would place them downwind among some rocks with a pot on top to make noise if the bears tried to open them. Ranger George said there were 24 reports of bearvaults failing, and 1 report of a bearikade failing. He was expecting a bear technician to arrive with three types of canisters, and the park bear technician was going to test them to see if the bear really could get into some of these designs. The results of that test is unknown to me.

There have been many reports of bears just walking past the bear canisters since they have learned that tying to get into them was a waste of time. But it only takes one success to ruin that. Ranger George told us that one bear found a bear vault that was not completely closed, and was able to open it. The next night, the same bear found another bearvault, and this bear spent 4 or 5 hours trying to open it.
 
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