Poll: Do you typically carry overnight gear on a winter 4K dayhike?

Poll: Do you typically carry overnight gear on a winter 4K day hike?

Question: Do you typically carry overnight gear on a winter 4K day hike?

Qualifier: I consider the following items to be overnight gear:

1: A sleeping bag
2: A windproof, waterproof barrier for the sleeping bag.
3: Something other than a backpack to sleep/sit on to separate your body from the ground. (This is the least important in my opinion as you don't HAVE to sleep to survive a night out - so sitting on a pack is acceptable to me.)

Background:
For the most part I am a fair-weather winter hiker as I drive 2 hours to get to the Whites and enjoy a number of winter activities besides hiking. I was having a discussion with my wife about how heavy our packs were for our Mt. Washington hike this past weekend and I told her that I'm sure many folks out there carry even more gear than I was - namely those who always or often carry a sleeping bag and something more than a space blanket bivy such as a goretex bivy or tent on winter hikes.

Solo vs. Group Preparedness:
Personally when hiking with others I don't bring quite as much emergency gear as when I hike solo. (Although I understand and sometimes agree with the notion that those who have more experience have the responsibility to be over-prepared to help out those in their party, or otherwise, who do not have as much experience and are under-prepared.) When solo, I would have to attend to my own broken, bruised, or otherwise injured body. That might mean at worst - crawling into a sleeping bag and emergency bivy and praying that I'm found before I expire.

So, that being said - I always:

1: Have an emergency space bivy in my pack
2: At least 1 dry base layer top, bottom and socks in case I have to stop moving for an extended period of time (I'm lost, sudden bad weather, or unable to walk but not life-threateningly injured).
3: I bring a puffy down jacket with me for hikes with extended periods above the treeline.
4: I often hike with plastic-bottom, roll-up foam sled that I could use as a seat/mat. If I don't have a sled I carry a mini z-rest closed cell foam seat.

In summary: When solo, I pack the sleeping bag AND down jacket, and consider the goretex bivy depending on mileage. When with a group, the sleeping bag and goretex bivy stay at home.

For a big time Winter hike, I carry a mini-sleeping bag, sometimes a stove. We always have first aid kit, extra clothes, etc. What box do I check?

Tom Rankin said:

For a big time Winter hike, I carry a mini-sleeping bag, sometimes a stove. We always have first aid kit, extra clothes, etc. What box do I check?

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I didn't involve stoves in the poll b/c I was only trying to generate discussion about shelter. I do think that having a way of obtaining water is important, and that warm liquids can be extremely helpful in some situations, but that's not where I was going with this.

To answer your question - I'd say that you fall into the "Depends on the hike" category.

Sleeping bag no.
Mylar survival bag and mylar blanket yes.

I always have a pad, bivy, puffy, and first aid rock
For larger, longer, colder trips I throw in the stove and light sleeping bag
Course no real need for duplicates on this stuff..

Yup

Winter, 4K, above treeline ... yes. A broken ankle can happen to anyone at any time. So I pack on the assumption that I might have to spend the night without the heat generated from movement. I pack not to be comfortable, but to survive. So I carry a summer weight down bag and an emergency bivy that weighs 3.8 oz. and which is shown here.

I carry everything, except sometimes I do not carry a real stove (but I do carry weatherproof matches and a tiny tin emergency stove contraption).

I pack for comfort. If I'm stuck outside, I want to be comfortable. Bad enough to be in pain and scared. I want to be toasty while I wait for SARS. My sleeping bag is a winter one, and roomy enough for both me and Alex to climb inside. It would be a tight squeeze, but we'd be plenty warm. We also both fit into the bivy tent. Again, tight squeeze, but we both fit (for now).

I carry enough warm clothing to be able to survive a night out: a down parka, insulated pants, mittens, booties and a small foam pad to sit on. Total weight is about 4 lbs. for those items.

I carry a Blizzard emergency bag, which combines the sleeping bag with a waterproof covering. I also carry a pad, and stove with small gas cannister. Where do I enter that in your poll?

Lots of variables. 100% of the time I will carry a warm puff jacket and a piece of a Ridge-Rest. I can suffer through just about anything with those two (short of a heavy rainfall).

Sometimes I've tossed my 4 lb. Bibler in if I'm solo in the backcountry. I have thrown a 0-degree bag in on occasion.

At other times, I've brought the bare minimums, depending on trail familiarity, popularity, and party size.

Kevin Rooney said:

I carry a Blizzard emergency bag, which combines the sleeping bag with a waterproof covering. I also carry a pad, and stove with small gas cannister. Where do I enter that in your poll?

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Debates about whether certain emergency biv sacks are warm enough to replace a sleeping bag are discussed in this thread.

I would say that your bivy is arguably better than mine, but that you still do NOT carry a sleeping bag.

I checked "only when solo" because that's when I always carry a sleeping bag, pad, and emergency biv sack. That said, I often carry the above when hiking with others, too.

Always a first aid kit, always a mylar emergency bag, always extra dry layers, always extra food.

I don't carry a stove. You draw the line somewhere ...

I also didn't check a box because I only carry a sleeping bag when with a group and the leader palms it off on me I do carry extra warm stuff, fire building material, space blanket, etc. which will allow survival if not comfort overnight.

hikingmaineac said:

3: Something other than a backpack to sleep/sit on to separate your body from the ground. (This is the least important in my opinion as you don't HAVE to sleep to survive a night out - so sitting on a pack is acceptable to me.)

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Along with my winter clothes, down jacket, hardshell and bivy, I carry an old 3/4 closed cell pad. I realize I could sit/lay on the pack, but a pad in winter is important. Like when winter camping, a pad or 2 allows everything else to do its job.

Silverfox said:

I always have a pad, bivy, puffy...

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A winter emergency is NOT the time to turn to drugs, fox...

If going in a group of 4 or more, I don't bring a bivy and sleeping bag (15° down bag, which is just under 2 lbs), but if less, then I do. If more people are in the group, they can assist while some go for help. With only 3 people, one of them being injured, only one can go for help while the other remains behind. If solo I might also bring a stove, but it depends on the peak. I always have fuel tabs and ignition source in my first aid kit, so I could light a fire if necessary.

On a more heavily traveled peak that is easier, I might forgo the additional items and just go light, since odds are good I'll run across other people. I always bring a down coat, GTX, and spare shirt/socks.

I carry what I consider overnight gear, namely enough to survive the night in something resembling comfort. I do not carry a sleeping bag (so I don't fit into your poll), but carry:
closed-cell foam pad, full length
canister stove and pot (not ideal for winter, but it'll get the job done, and the Whisperlite's a lot of weight for "just in case.")
AMK emergency bivy
spare socks and liner gloves
one extra insulating layer, top (primaloft jacket of some sort) and bottom (micropuff full-zip pants). Clothing seems to me to be a little more flexible than a sleeping bag of comparable weight...for a group hike, the sleeping bag of course opens up some options in terms of hypo wrap and the like. If I ever find myself without an extra layer, I'll make note of that and pack another next time...so far it hasn't happened.

Extra top layer, nylon pants & jacket for a light wt layer I could stuff with anything I can find for extra insulation, small foam pad, several 55 gal garbage bags, emergence space blanket bag, emergency bivy bag, candle lantern, small lite wt tarp, hand warmers, fluffy vest, candle or alcohol stove with a metal cup.

I could bundle/roll up in all this stuff and be warmism for a night.

Wow, I feel pretty left out. I don't bring any of the things mentioned, not even a first-aid kit (although I do carry duct tape). I have a few handwarmers, extra gloves and a parka that I think is useless and will probably stop bringing. I don't have a sleeping bag, tent, stove, or even extra clothes... not even a spare hat.

I'm not a particularly tough or rugged person nor do I like taking risks. But at the same time I'd rather hike lighter than heavier and don't feel the need to take along all that superfluous gear or that it would even help me. Perhaps without all the emergency stuff I'm less likely to put myself in a situation that I will need it.... plus, if I'm injured but can still manage to set up a tent, make myself dinner and crawl into a sleeping bag, I can still manage to crawl a few miles to a trail head and get help.

But hey, what you take on the trail is your business and what I take on the trail is my business. I've never asked someone that I'm hiking with if they have this or that and the people that I hike with usually don't care what type of weird stuff I have in my pack. Live Free or Die, baby!

-Dr. Wu

This is a really helpful discussion for someone who is learning. I've been able to do a few hikes earlier in the winter, and I had my cold weather bag, stove, first aid kit, emergency blanket and a few other emergency supplies. I was wondering if I was crazy carrying all this stuff, but it doesn't appear to be the case. I'd rather carry the extra weight and never use any of the things I've brought than get hurt or stranded and realize that I am up a creek without a paddle.

Casual Hiker said:

I'd rather carry the extra weight and never use any of the things I've brought than get hurt or stranded and realize that I am up a creek without a paddle.

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I would make the argument that if you got hurt or stranded and did not have any of those things in your pack that with will, determination and at least 1/2 a nut in your head you'd be able to make it to safety. I guess you can ask yourself if having those items would make you take greater risks because they some how give you more confidence? I think that humans are a lot tougher and more resilient than our culture gives us credit for. When did we become so fragile and helpless in the face of injury, bad weather or getting lost? I don't think we are. A few generations ago, people didn't have these comforts (sometimes extreme comforts) and they managed all right. These days we have, at a minimum, better maps, more road access, more trails to get to the road etc.

If you take a sleeping bag, tent etc it doesn't make you dumb or stupid or a weenie but there is, in my opinion, another viable and legitimate (and in my opinion better) perceptive on hiking "safe" than what others put forth here...

-Dr. Wu