MSR Lightening Ascents

[Kevin Judy and Emma]

I busted a brand new (maybe 50 miles) MSR snowshoe. The front cleat broke right off. I didn't trip on anything, I didn't even notice when it broke. We were on very hard snow all day, like concrete, but they performed admirably. On the way back out I looked down and noticed my boot was way forward. Then I inspected closer and realized the snowshoe had broken and the cleat was gone. I was able to wear them the rest of the way out, but I was bummed!

My question is this: what do I do now? Take them back to REI, or contact MSR directly?

KDT

 

[ADKdremn]

Either way, you'll more than likely wind up with a new pair. If you go through MSR you may have to pay shipping. If you're close enough to an REI they may just give you a new pair right there. From what I've heard MSR is very good with customer service.

 

[highonlife]

Mine broke, I sent them to MSR and they sent me a new pair. Others I have hiked with have experienced same breaks.

 

[hillman1]

Mine broke, and I was SOL. They offered me a new pair of any model at thier cost though. I went with the denali evo ascent model after that. Mine had only been on about 5 hikes when the catastrophe happened.

 

[miehoff]

MSR Customer Service

They are great at helping you with broken parts, etc. My Hubba Hubba poles developed a crack and they sent them 2 day so I could have them for a trip. I do hope my new "lightning" shoes hold up. I bought them thinking that they looked durable, well made, and oddly enough, that the parts seemed replaceable. Ahhh. They are super light. I love that.

 

[Kevin Judy and Emma]

Shoes

From the sound of things, maybe these shoes aren't as well built as I had heard/thought? I will continue to post as things transpire.

KDT

 

[MEB]

I got a pair of the fancy MSR lightening assents for my birthday back in 2006. After the first few hikes I lost some of the rivots that held the binding. I took them back to Beans and they fixed it for me at no charge.

As the winter went on I noticed the decking was starting to tear but they seemed to be holding up pretty well.

The beginning of winter 2007 is was out on the Osceola's. About 1/2 way through the hike I noticed one of my feet was pointing in a funny direction...so I took a look at the snowshoe....the front cleat had broken on both sides. Then I decided to take a look at my other shoe.....the crampon had completely broken off.

For the amount of money that was spent on these I would expect them to hold up better. I contacted MRS and explained what happened. I got the usual response of "oh my, this has never happened before....and these snowshoes are tested on thr roughest terrain...you must have a monday morning pair. If you want to send them back we will take a look at them."

After trying out a few other pairs of snowshoes I ended up getting another pair of MSR's....the Denali Assents. So far they are doing well and they were 1/2 the cost of the fancy ones.

Good luck.

-MEB

 

[Chip]

From the sound of things, maybe these shoes aren't as well built as I had heard/thought? I will continue to post as things transpire.

KDT

For what it's worth; there have been many discussions here about MSR snowshoes, more than any other brand. The thread usually begins with something like "I love my MSR's but they broke." This thread of Neil's is 3 years old and includes a response from MSR. I'm not an engineer, but it appears to me as though the MSR's lack any redundancy in their binding; if one point fails you're done. There have also been issues with other parts of the shoe cracking. Not a scientific sample, but I've been on the same pair of shoes for the past 4 years with no issues.

 

[Paradox]

I have a pair of the Tubbs Mountaineer snowshoes. The plastic binding failed in one shoe during the third trip out and there was only about 12 miles on it. No redundancy there either. I had to bareboot back to the car for about a mile. Tubbs fixed them free of charge but the shipping cost $25 and I was without them for the rest of the season.

I have about 60 miles on my MSR's and inspect them regularly and they seem to be doing nicely though there is a touch of white in the plastic in the common failure point. I'm about 240 lbs all geared up.

 

[peakbagger]

My occasional observations of off rental MSR's over the years has frequently been any eye opener. Granted, these are rentals and are not treated very well but there is frequently at least one defect that it is apparent on the batch of shoes from a particular year. Over the years, they usually come out with a new and improved model that usually is a fix of problems from prior years.

Fortunately, this issue seems to be isolated to their attempts at snowshoes, their other gear seems to be bombproof.

Sounds like they need to recruit some New England hardcores (any volunteers) to test their equipment in eastern snow

 

[DougPaul]

For what it's worth; there have been many discussions here about MSR snowshoes, more than any other brand. The thread usually begins with something like "I love my MSR's but they broke." This thread of Neil's is 3 years old and includes a response from MSR. I'm not an engineer, but it appears to me as though the MSR's lack any redundancy in their binding; if one point fails you're done. There have also been issues with other parts of the shoe cracking. Not a scientific sample, but I've been on the same pair of shoes for the past 4 years with no issues.

Let us not forget that there are two basic lines of snowshoe from MSR--the Lightning series (a metal frame with a solid neopreme deck, the topic under discussion here) and the Denali series (plastic frame and deck with aggressive metal crampons and rails underneath, off topic in this thread).

The reports here suggest that the Lightning series are unreliable, but experience has shown the Denali series to be pretty reliable. (Neil's report refers to a defective lot from the Denali series.)

One of the reasons that there are so many reports about the MSR snowshoes is that they are quite popular among serious winter hikers. Snowshoes live a hard life with heavy hikers banging them on uneven rocks--occasional failures are to be expected.

Doug

 

[Kevin Judy and Emma]

Previous thread on MSR's

Believe it or not I just read the entire thread from 2005. Mostly they were talking about the Denali Ascents and mine are the Lightening Ascents. They seem to be quite different. I'm not sure about the cleats. I really liked my LA's and was shocked when I noticed they were broken. They had performed admirably on each hike so far, though it's only been a few hikes.

Some things I picked up from the thread are, (and excuse my naivety): Expect everything to break, no matter what brand or model. Have back -up parts. These are things I hadn't thought about. My old Tubbs have lasted forever with no repairs, although I can't claim too many 4k's with them. I wanted the MSR LA's because I had heard good things, knew people who did the winter 4k's in them and I wanted a more aggressive cleat as I had trouble taking purchase in some conditions with the Tubbs.

I was impressed with the personalized apology from MSR Neil received. I have not got around to contacting them, too busy. May try tonight. I'm not thrilled about the idea of paying shipping, may just go back to REI.

One other thing from the thread, someone said that snowshoes are made for snow and should never be worn on hardpack. The snow we were on was crust hard enough to support my 220+#'s w/pack. Should we have been wearing something else in those conditions? The snowshoes were working fine, literally gripping the frozen snow and I was quite pleased with them. I know from experience that the Tubb's I own wouldn't have worked as well in that type of snow.

KDT

 

[JoeCedar]

For a comparison of Denali Evo Ascents vs. Lightning Ascents read my post #8 under

http://www.vftt.org/forums/showthread.php?t=19650

Since that post I had the crampon rivet pull out on the Lightnings again (4th time). I sent them to MSR and the guy in the warranty department suggested that they were not going to just keep replacing them. I said they were "defective in material and workmanship" under their warranty, and the fact they kept breaking was not my fault since it was "normal use".

He had the gall to suggest it was time for me to consider buying another type of snowshoe!!! With further negotiation they offered to sell me a new pair of Lightning Ascents for "near wholesale" $159.00. I said that was nice, but if he looked at them he would see my snowshoes were in nearly new condition (they spent most of their lifetime broken). All they needed was a crampon which would not break under normal use. He agreed to replace my older 2 strap binding with the new 3 strap binding on the 2007 models. I haven't got them back yet, but if these bindings fail at the crampon rivet, the Lightnings are going into the recycling bin, with the other trash.

I would not buy them again, that's for sure, even though they perform great under a variety of conditions. My thinking is that MSR sacrificed strength of material for weight, for marketing purposes, so they could claim "lightest in their class". All they need is to use thicker gauge metal (or stronger) in the crampon and change to iron rivets from aluminum. I told him all this but he was just a "customer service representative" and unfortunately such feedback rarely makes it back to the design department. And MSR will wonder why there are so many dissatisfied customers!

Update on the Denali evo's I bought last fall: They are much stronger and have been trouble free for the last three months. Same guy, same weight, same mountains, same variety of conditions--and no failures.

You choose.......

 

[bikehikeskifish]

When I startup a company that "makes things that last" I will add snowshoes to the list. I'm starting it to make strong but light bicycle parts for people who are over the usual "Rider limit: 180 pounds" (I'm 6'3" @200 pounds). Wheels are a good place, along with pedal and crank systems, and chains and sprockets which survive more than one season. Bicycle computers with wiring and contact points that can handle getting rained on or humidity, etc. should complete the first product offering.

I also plan to make lawnmower blades that can survive mowing in the granite state for more than 1 or 2 seasons, and wheels for lawnmowers which are not plastic, or which don't get worn smooth after two years on a "New Hampshire Flat" lawn

I'm holding up my Honda automobile, the Honda engine on my lawnmower, and my John Deere snowblower as examples of products which are built to last.

I have the plain MSR Denali Ascents (no EVO). My second pair, because the original pair lasted 3 trips before the televator started slipping backwards on its own. I can attribute it to pilot error, and the second set shows no signs of wear in that area after 2 trips of their own.

Tim

 

[hillman1]

I just want to add after my previous post, that I am on my third pair of msr decks. I was part of the trip with Neil that saw my denalis break. I toasted a pair lightning ascents on a trip to gray from marcy kicking out of spruce traps. I still think the lightning ascents are incredible, just not for me. I now use the denali evo ascents, and I think they will last through anything. I have abused them in ways they are definitely not made for, and they are still working perfectly. Bu I have noticed surface rust forming on the side bars on the bottom if I leave them in my car between uses.

 

[una_dogger]

I recall last winter several posters who had purchased the non Evo Denali Ascents were having problems with the plastic frame breaking in the front corners -- something to do with the type of plastic which is NOT used for the Denali Evo Ascents.

That said, both MichaelJ and I have the Denali Evo Ascents and we are extremely happy with them. In comparing them to the Lightning Ascents, I chose the Evos because I felt the placement of the linear crampon/grip edge was more central, under the weight of the user, as opposed to the Lightnings that have the linear crampons running around the outline of the snowshoe. Not sure if it makes a difference or not, but it was a design difference that caught my eye.

 

[DougPaul]

I recall last winter several posters who had purchased the non Evo Denali Ascents were having problems with the plastic frame breaking in the front corners -- something to do with the type of plastic which is NOT used for the Denali Evo Ascents.

That said, both MichaelJ and I have the Denali Evo Ascents and we are extremely happy with them.

I switched from (non-Evo) Denali Ascents to Evo Denali Ascents because the toe hole in the non-Evos was too small for my double boots + super gaiters. Neither showed/is showing any signs of failure.

Doug

 

[JoeCedar]

Rusting

But I have noticed surface rust forming on the side bars on the bottom if I leave them in my car between uses.

Doug,

The rusting you see is most probably due to road salt you picked up when wearing your snowshoes to the car--nice to sit down and take them off! If you avoid salted parking areas, you won't see the rusting. It's a minor superficial rusting anyway.

After all my troubles with the Lightnings--superior in performance but inferior in durability--I am getting good service and use from the evo Ascents.

 

[bikehikeskifish]

Rinse 'em, dry 'em, WD-40 'em.

Tim

 

[Ed'n Lauky]

I'm a Yukon Charlie guy myself. I was given a pair at least five years ago and I can't wear them out. I take it back, I did wear out the crampons, but I contacted the company and they sent me another set that I put on myself. Other than that they show no real signs of wear.

I do concede that on really steep slopes I don't get enough traction and have on occasion switched to straight crampons. Also, I have taken them off on trails going diagonally across a steep slope where I thought I was going to end up in the ravine. For that reason I've thought about getting some MSRs but haven't made the leap yet.

The input in this thread has made for some good pre-shopping info.