Ageism or Irresponsibility?

[ChrisB]

Maybe you folks can help me sort out a question I have regarding a recent rescue in Pinkham Notch...

The victim was an 83-year-old male who was hiking solo. He initially fell descending the Wildcat Ridge Trail and then again on the Lost Pond Trail, suffering a head injury. He called for a rescue after the second fall. (This guy chose to return on Lost Pond rather than do the easy road walk up Rt 16 to Pinkham, but that's another issue of judgement.)

His rescue required a difficult carry at the end of a long day for F&G. So here is my question:

Is it irresponsible for an 83 year old to attempt a hike (solo or otherwise) in the Whites?

I recall the guy who had a hip replacement that would occasionally dislocate being deemed irresponsible and charged for his rescue on Franconia Ridge a few years ago.

Do you think this aged fellow should be charged for his rescue?

 

[TCD]

Case by case. There are 60 year-olds who cannot walk around the block, and should not go into the mountains. But when Jackrabbit Johansson was 83, he could have carried this guy out on his shoulder.

 

[maineguy]

His rescue required a difficult carry at the end of a long day for F&G. So here is my question:

Is it irresponsible for an 83 year old to attempt a hike (solo or otherwise) in the Whites?

Do you think this aged fellow should be charged for his rescue?

No and No

 

[JoshandBaron]

Given the rain we've had this year, the crossing of the Ellis at rt16 could have been dicey. People often opt for Lost Pond even on a good day. Considering Lost Pond Trail isn't even a mile long he couldn't have been far on it if they carried him a mile.

 

[dug]

The saying "age is just a number" is true. There are 80 year olds who are more than capable of many a hike; more than many 30 year olds who never leave the couch.

 

[jrcinnh]

First, I happened to hike lost pond that same day for redlining, the water crossing to Glen Ellis required wading or a pretty long jump, so his trail choice was not unreasonable.
Second, my 82 year old mother has decent physical capabilities, but has alzheimers, others have the reverse conditions. I don't think age alone is enough to judge a person's mental or physical hiking capabilities. But, it's a factor.

 

[Rhody Seth]

The saying "age is just a number" is true. There are 80 year olds who are more than capable of many a hike; more than many 30 year olds who never leave the couch.

Whether you get into trouble because you're an out-of-shape 30 year old or an 80 year old overextending yourself, I don't think people should be charged for rescues due to pushing beyond their limits.

That said let's not kid ourselves - physical and cognitive decline are real factors as we age. I'm sure all of us that hike solo will be hard pressed to "give up the reins" so to speak when the time comes.

 

[dug]

Whether you get into trouble because you're an out-of-shape 30 year old or an 80 year old overextending yourself, I don't think people should be charged for rescues due to pushing beyond their limits.

That said let's not kid ourselves - physical and cognitive decline are real factors as we age. I'm sure all of us that hike solo will be hard pressed to "give up the reins" so to speak when the time comes.

Agree, but I can't see how we put a clear line on an age. The closest I can think of is my mother, and her best friend. Both in their 70's. My mother eventually got to the point where she wouldn't go alone, and then only small trails, and then not at all. She knew. Her friend, however, still leads AMC trips throughout the world and hasn't really changed herself much. Two people, similar age, who dealt with it differently because they were different.

I'm only in my 50's and already have had to scale things back considerably due to various physical ailments. Some of you have blown past that with little to no change.

 

[Grey J]

I don't think he is irresponsible for hiking solo at 83. It all depends on his condition. If he fell descending, then he must have been capable enough to do the climb. At 71, this is an issue that has reared its ugly presence in my head. I was in great shape (for my age) before my recent illness 2 years ago that nearly killed me and also put me in a wheelchair and a rehab facility and forced me to learn how to walk again. I'm back on the trails now but the combination of age and neuropathy in my feet has made me more cautious regarding what I hike and how I do it. I'm now operating in the 2500–3500-foot range in the Whites and I use hiking poles on the descent. I would cut this man some slack. You can fall and get hurt in your 30s too.

 

[MikePS]

I agree that there is no "magic" age cutoff, very different for each individual. But it is an important area of judgement, similar to proper equipment and safe conditions. At some point it can cross the line of reckless. As I venture into my upper 60s, as mostly a solo hiker, I certainly have grown more cautious about the hikes I take on, especially concerning weather conditions and water crossings. For me it will not be the ascent that will eventually age me out, as I can go up close to the same speed as I did twenty years ago. The descents, however, have begun to give me issues, I am generally slower on the downs than the ups on most trails. I agree with Rhody Seth, giving up the reins will be a difficult moment. I hope I make the decision before crossing the line, but boy it seems like it will be difficult. Just yesterday I met two older couples (at least mid seventies) on the first little choppy part of the Zealand trail. They were moving pretty slow, and I was surprised they were heading out to Thoreau falls, an 8 mile out and back, and it was close to noon. However, their gear and attitude demonstrated genuine hiking experience, so not sure how to assess that. Obviously a growing issue based on the demographics I observe on the trails these days.

 

[Mountain Thunder]

Maybe you folks can help me sort out a question I have regarding a recent rescue in Pinkham Notch...

The victim was an 83-year-old male who was hiking solo. He initially fell descending the Wildcat Ridge Trail and then again on the Lost Pond Trail, suffering a head injury. He called for a rescue after the second fall. (This guy chose to return on Lost Pond rather than do the easy road walk up Rt 16 to Pinkham, but that's another issue of judgement.)

His rescue required a difficult carry at the end of a long day for F&G. So here is my question:

Is it irresponsible for an 83 year old to attempt a hike (solo or otherwise) in the Whites?

I recall the guy who had a hip replacement that would occasionally dislocate being deemed irresponsible and charged for his rescue on Franconia Ridge a few years ago.

Do you think this aged fellow should be charged for his rescue?

Case by case, as has been pointed out. But ego often knows no restraint, regardless of age.

 

[skiguy]

Case by case, as has been pointed out. But ego often knows no restraint, regardless of age.

Well put.

 

[Jasper]

Maybe you folks can help me sort out a question I have regarding a recent rescue in Pinkham Notch...

The victim was an 83-year-old male who was hiking solo. He initially fell descending the Wildcat Ridge Trail and then again on the Lost Pond Trail, suffering a head injury. He called for a rescue after the second fall. (This guy chose to return on Lost Pond rather than do the easy road walk up Rt 16 to Pinkham, but that's another issue of judgement.)

His rescue required a difficult carry at the end of a long day for F&G. So here is my question:

Is it irresponsible for an 83 year old to attempt a hike (solo or otherwise) in the Whites?

I recall the guy who had a hip replacement that would occasionally dislocate being deemed irresponsible and charged for his rescue on Franconia Ridge a few years ago.

Do you think this aged fellow should be charged for his rescue?

It is a situation I faced this early.
I'm 77 years old, in good physical condition and ok mentally. (???) I still hike the Whites but no longer solo. I had a nasty fall last winter while hiking solo on the Kinsman Ridge. The fall and the realities of aging have made me more circumspect. Earlier this year I stopped leading AMC winter hikes in the whites.

 

[sierra]

Hiking is about freedom, to even suggest that someone of any age should not hike, goes against the very principle of being in the mountains and is discrimination at the least. Everybody is different, even if an 80-year-old is past his prime, he has the right to go out and go for it anyway. If he gets hurt, or becomes a fatality, so be it. I've been soloing for over 40 years, there is a reasonable chance, I might be found someday in a less than appreciable state by some poor hikers who happen upon me.
P.S. Please don't make the, but it puts SAR at risk comment.

 

[Sherby]

Hiking is about freedom, to even suggest that someone of any age should not hike, goes against the very principle of being in the mountains and is discrimination at the least. Everybody is different, even if an 80-year-old is past his prime, he has the right to go out and go for it anyway. If he gets hurt, or becomes a fatality, so be it. I've been soloing for over 40 years, there is a reasonable chance, I might be found someday in a less than appreciable state by some poor hikers who happen upon me.
P.S. Please don't make the, but it puts SAR at risk comment.

I think Gerry Roach agrees with you : Legendary Colorado climber Gerry Roach injured in 13er climb

 

[sierra]

I think Gerry Roach agrees with you : Legendary Colorado climber Gerry Roach injured in 13er climb

I saw that, I hope he is doing well. I have both his 14er and 13er books, some of the best guidebooks, I have ever used.

 

[JToll]

I do not think any conclusion can be drawn just because someone is 83 years old. I do not think he should be charged for a rescue just because he is 83. I do not think it is irresponsible for someone to hike just because they are 83. As with most rescue reports there really are not enough details to draw any conclusions. Had he summitted the Wildcats? What equipment did he have? How long did he hike after his first injury? What was his first injury?

I know people at 63 that I would hesitate to take on the Franconia Notch bike path. A lot more than age is involved.

Just for the record I am 71 and never hike solo. Yes I am slower than I was 10 years ago. I seldom break book time now. Yet this year I have climbed Madison Gulf Trail and Six Husbands Trail, along with a climb to the summit of Mt Adams. I know at sometime I will have to scale back my hiking.

 

[Beckie and Prema]

Turned 66 this past Monday. I was slow in my 40s and I'm slow now. I am so happy to hear someone 5 years older than me got up the Madison Gulf Trail and Six Husbands; they are on my to-do list. Prema (my daughter, 28 years younger) is with me 99% of the time and keeps me out of trouble. I am responsible and if the 83 year old is responsible as well I see no problem.

 

[Dana]

A few years ago I was hiking Baldface with my daughter and meet another man at the trailhead who was heading out with his daughter. He was in his 80s and she was about my age (50 something at the time), he asked where we were going. We told him our route, and with a tear in his eye he said, "Oh yes, that's a nice hike. I can't do that any more, we're taking the flat hike in the other direction."

I'm 63 now and hope my daughter will still be hiking with me in 20 years. If I don't disappear first, I mostly hike solo and off trail.

 

[maineguy]

A number of years ago I was ascending the Webster Cliff Trail on the way to Jackson for the Flags on the 48 celebration. About 1/2 way up the trail I caught up to a woman (hiking alone) who was easily in her 80s. We exchanged pleasantries, and I remarked to her that I hope when I am her age I will still be able to hike these mountains. Her response, which I will never forget was: "be careful what you wish for". I wish I had asked her what she meant by that. I can only guess that she had either outlived all her hiking buddies, or they could not hike anymore.

She made it to Jackson in time to see the flag flying and then soon after headed back down. She's probably still hiking.