Bushwacking to Fir from Big Indian? Catskills Question

[EarthNsky]

Is it possible to hike from Big Indian, off the Pine Hill West Br Trail to Fir Mountain? Or do you have to continue south on the PHW to Biscut Brook and bushwack up from there? It looks like there is a potential route on the ridge between Fir and Big Indian (Delaware/Hudson divide), but the 3500 website recommends bushwacking up Biscut Run from the PHW.

The day I plan to get Fir (Friday March 10th), I'd also like to get Balsam, Eagle and Big Indian.

Thanks..

 

[mudhook51]

Fir-BI,there is a route across the ridge. If its clear ,you can see your goal. There is a bend in the ridge, so its not a direct course. Hows your compass skills?

 

[Mark Schaefer]

I agree with Mudhook that if it is clear it is easy to go from Big Indian to Fir. The eastern ridge from Big Indian funnels you right to the narrow saddle. Finding it from Fir is just a bit more of a challenge as there is no visual indication of a west ridge to the saddle atop the N-S summit ridge of Fir. So you may need to do some side hilling on the western slope of Fir on your return trip.

The club's recommended southern approach is the fastest way to do Fir with Big Indian. If you want to combine with Balsam and Eagle you will want to use one of the northern trailheads. Perhaps the shortest route for your four summits would be a loop using the McKenley Hollow trailhead and the bushwhack parking area on Burnham Hollow Road. Since the Burnham Hollow access is a narrow strip of state land on the road south from the PA (shown on NY/NJ Map #42) it might be easier to start there. And if you need to finish with head lamps you will be on trails and/or the fairly short road walk.

 

[MattC]

If you really want to get all four, I think Mark's suggestion about Burnham Hollow is a good one. If you have a second car, I'd leave one in McKinley Hollow and go around and start from Burnham Hollow. About a month ago, T-max and Hike the 115 got three of those four peaks using a variation of this. They came in from Burnham Hollow, bagged Fir, Big Indian and met me on Eagle. I had 'whacked up from McKinley Hollow and we returned to my car there, where I shuttled them back to Burnham.

If you come over Big Indian to Fir and then have to reclimb Big Indian, it could be tiring. Climbing the Big I from the Fir side goes on for a while-it's flat, steep/ledgy, flat, steep/ledgy, flat, steep/ledgy...
As Mark points, if you start from Burnham, you get the orienteering and 'whacking in early, and walk out on trail. You also avoid the McKinley Hollow brook crossings until the end of the hike, when it's not as big a deal if you get a little wet. Not that I would know anything about getting wet on a brook crossing. Ahem...

One drawback to using the Burnham to McKinley route-it leaves Balsam for last, and I know you want that one because of it's "winter requirement" status. Which brings it back to the whole issue of doing all four in one day.

Matt

 

[mudhook51]

I agree with Mark and Matt about starting Burnham Rd.You get the bushwack done early, the rest is trailed.Plus you could bail out before going to Balsam (or Eagle) if things got iffy.

 

[Jay H]

Nah, there's a sign posted just east of Big Indian which says

Bushwacking to Fir is illegal, turn around.. now.. DAM

hahaha, like the others mentions, just be careful of DAM (Drainage Avoidance Manuevering) cause there is a DAM involved between Fir and Big Indian.

Jay

 

[mudhook51]

hahaha, like the others mentions, just be careful of DAM (Drainage Avoidance Manuevering) cause there is a DAM involved between Fir and Big Indian.

Jay[/QUOTE]

How true. I failed DAM 101 in that very spot!

 

[EarthNsky]

I like the idea of making it a loop. I plan on camping thursday night at the McKennley Hollow Leanto and that loop idea would work out well.

thanks guys for the info!

 

[Jay H]

You know what a neat trip would be?

Opposite end, bring downhill skis, go do Fir, Big Indian, Eagle, Balsam, and hike out to Belleayre and then ski down Cathedral Run to the Catherdral Woods trail out to the town of High Mount... find a way back to McKenley hollow...

Leanto at Lost Clove or Hirchman's Leanto on Belleayre (no water)...

That would be a neat trip, though I think downhill skiing with a full pack would be interesting...

Jay

 

[RoySwkr]

I did a hike (in summer) starting at the Slide Mtn parking lot over E Hemlock, Hemlock, Spruce, Fir, Big Indian, Eagle, Haynes, and Balsam and out McKenley Hollow to get as many trees as possible. Days are shorter and walking tougher in winter, but I think any subset is possible.

 

[Jay H]

East Hemlock is also known as Winnisook Peak? That is the one that is closest to Slide Mtn Road? I've done Hemlock and Spruce before, but that was a big loop with MCorsar that I did, I started on the Slide Parking lot, went and did my Trail Maintenance on the CO trail, then camped at East Wildcat. Met Mcorsar the next morning and we did West Wildcat, down to Biscuit Brook, then we skipped fir and went simply to Spruce, Hemlock, and Winnisook Peak back to Slide Mtn Road.

Winnisook or East Hemlock is a nice little peak with a rocky flat ledge on top with good views on it, It's a very nice steep climb though from SMR with views that make the climb worth it and you can simply follow the Winnisook Lake property borders from the granite slab.

Jay

 

[EarthNsky]

much thanks for all the info guys, now some more ?s

does anyone have the waypoint coordinates for the summit of Big Indian? Where do you turn off the PHW to go to Big Indian, are there any signs? Also, anyone have the way points for Balsam and the Burnham Hollow Rd trailhead? Looks like you can bushwack down to Elk Brook and then down the the rd, but there is also a nice ridge, that doesn't look that steep that heads down to the road as well. Altogether, it doesn't appear to be that steep of a descent to Burnham Hollow.

Lastly, does anyone have the waypoints for Halcott?

Thanks again for the help.

PS: Anyone interested in joining us? We got a lot on the plate this weekend and the weather looks decent, inspite of the rain in the forecast.

 

[Tom Rankin]

Where do you turn off the PHW to go to Big Indian, are there any signs?

There is no official sign, although there is sometimes a small cairn. There are at least 2 herd paths in the summer.

My general advice would be to go about as far as you think you should based on the map distance, and then maybe a little farther. I'd bet that a lot of people on that trail are heading to Big Indian, so if the trail is broken, you can probably expect to find the herd path in about the same shape. If no path presents itself, just start up. The woods are not very thick there. It's less than .25 miles to the summit. I've found the summit from 3 different directions in the past, so I have to assume that it's fairly straightforward.

 

[Jay H]

Well, the PHW branch goes through private land borders just before the closest access point to big indian as you should be able to see on the TC maps... It is a common point to bushwack to Doubletop but anyway, going north on the PHW branch, you will come across to about 3500' or so, see the first yellow property blaze, continue north, see the second one noting that you are once again entering state land. Now you can kind of time yourself knowing your pace til you get to height of land and then head towards BI. Looking at your map, the closest point to the trail for BI isn't that far north of the property border which is marked.

You can even take a good bearing from the property border if you feel inclined but I think most people just kind of walk into the woods and walk up

jay

 

[EarthNsky]

I read over all your suggestions and I formulated a new plan and now I am truly stoked for this weekend to hurry up and get here. Thanks for all your help. Any info on where the drainage that requires avoidance between Fir and BI?

New plan:

Thursday night, camp at Giant Ledge and friday morning tag Panther and then hike back out to Slide Mountain Rd. Then from the WS trailhead on Slide Rd, hike up to Slide on the WS and then come down the CO and PE.

Friday night I am staying at the Black Bear Lodge, so if anyone wants to meet up for some beers, let me know.

Saturday, we're going to shuttle cars to the Burnham Hollow trailhead and the McKennley Hollow Trailhead. We're going to start by bushwacking up Fir from Burnham Hollow and then cross the ridge to Big Indian and onto the PHW trail and then hike it north over Eagle and up to Balsam. From Balsam we'll backtrack to the OM trail and hike it east into McKennley Hollow (I understand this is one of the steepest trails in the Catskills) and camp at the McKennley Hollow Lean-to Saturday night.

Sunday, hike out to the vehicles and then drive up and get Halcott from 42. Then if there is still time, we'll try and meet you guys at the Last Chance Cheese Shop in Tannersville.

 

[mudhook51]

We did the BI-Fir trip last sunday with a group of 8. There should/might be tracks left in the deep snow across the col between the peaks, and from the PH trail to BI.