Community Water Safety Course?

[TomEske]

I'm working toward getting my NYS Guide's License, and even though I am just looking at Hiking and Camping, the State requires the above mentioned course given by the Red Cross. Try as I might, I cannot find the course offered anywhere in southeastern NY State. Does anyone have any experience with this? Maybe there are a few licensed Guides out there who can tell me something that the State is not?
I am also trying to figure out if they will accept my Basic First Aid card, instead of the "Community First Aid" course they are asking for. I can find no reference to a course by that name even existing. (Eventually I expect to take a NOLS, WFA, or SOLO course, which should render the point moot anyway.)
Thanks for any advice.
Happy Hiking,
Tom

 

[raftingguy]

Tom,

Contact the New York State Outdoor Guides Association. They hold an annual conference where, among other things, they offer all the courses needed to obtain your guiding license. One of the courses they offer is a water safety course that qualifies with the state.

Unfortunately, the American Red Cross stopped offering their Basic Water Safety course. I don't know of any other courses that will work, but if you can't attend NYSOGA's conference, they may be able to point you in the right direction.

As for the first aid, I think Community First Aid refers to the Red Cross course that has standard first aid and CPR. I could be wrong. Basically, what you need is a first aid course and a CPR course. I'm pretty sure almost anything that gives you a certification card should work.

NYSOGA website

 

[TomEske]

Thanks RaftingGuy,
But I'm not really looking to kill a weekend and a bunch of bucks on this. The license is costly enough. I did know about the NYSOGA group, and if this pans out, I will probably sign up with them, but in the meantime I'm just trying to get the ticket done and take the test.
It figures that the State would demand a course that is no longer offered, just like the good ol' DEC.
I guess what I have for First Aid is fine then, because I've got both that and CPR.
To be honest, I'm just persuing the license for the fun of it. I have no grand plans to open a guide service, although there are some days on the Trail when I feel like a tourguide to a lot of newbies I meet. I'm most curious to see what they have on the test, because I can't find any sample tests anywhere.
Thanks for your input,
Tom

 

[Rick]

Tom, I got my Community Water Safety a few yeas ago through Pack, Paddle & Ski (www.Packpaddleski.com) south of Rochester NY. I think they are giving the course again this year.

 

[brianW]

Tom, I took this course years ago. Community Water Saftey goes over rescues that do not require the rescuer to enter the water. If the Red Cross is no longer offering this maybe a Lifeguard course (which goes in more depth) would be excepted as an alternate?

 

[raftingguy]

Tom,

You might want to contact NYSOGA anyway. I'm pretty sure you don't have to attend the whole weekend. You might be able to show up just for the water safety course.

As for the test, you won't find any sample tests, but it's pretty easy. One question I remember is: On NYS Land, what type of wood can be used for firewood? It's all multiple choice. On one question they gave you a small section of topographical map, and then you had to select the mountain profile the map represented. Basically, anyone that spends a decent amount of time outdoors can pass the test. Obviously, if you get into whitewater and rock climbing the tests get more technical, but you aren't heading in that direction.

 

[TomEske]

Well, I may go that way, but I've missed the course for this year I think. I'd like to find something closer, (southeastern NYS) because I think the class is only a couple of hours and includes no actual water work. I am definately not the lifeguard type, so a full lifeguard course is not practical for me.
As far as the test goes, just last night I talked to a friend who I had forgotten was a licensed Guide. When I asked what the test was like, she looked at me, made a squirrely face, and said I could have passed "that test when I was 14". She tells me I will require no study and should breeze through it. She also encouraged me to get the boating section of the license in addition to hiking and camping. She said I would breeze through that also, just based on my common knowledge. ( I was raised on a boat.)
It sounds to me like the tough part of getting a license is filling out the papaerwork and collecting the certifications that the State requires (such as courses that are no longer available).
Thanks to all for the suggestions,
Tom

 

[iceNsnow]

Jewish community center in Nisky

Hi Tom!
I fulfilled my water safety NYS guide requirements last year by taking a course at the Jewish Community Center in Niskauna (can't spell it/?!), near Schenectady. It was cheap and only a few hours one night.

Email me at [email protected] if you want the guy's name and phone no.. He organizes the groups based on requests.

I wish you well,
Inge

 

[raftingguy]

Tom,

Getting and maintaining the certifications is the biggest pain of the guide license. And of course sending in the money!!!

 

[mavs00]

Tom,

I'm actually a college & age group level swim coach in western NY and not only am familiar with these courses, but am a Water Safety Course Instructor to boot. My suggestion, first try the American Red Cross. I've no idea where you live, but you may have to call a chapter in a larger city if yoy live in a real rural area that doesn't offer much. These are pretty specific courses and they likely won't have a list of available course times, but they'll certainly have a list of instructors that are "qualified to teach it". Then it's a matter of contacting them and finding out when it's offered.

Or, if you want to skip that step. Call your local aquatics facilities (i.e. pools) such as colleges, high schools, swim clubs, and community centers in your area. Most will have (at least) one person on staff that is a instructor, as just about every water job, (like learn-to-swim teachers, lifequards, swim coaches, etc.) requires these classes for employment. It's a few hours at most and is the most basic aquatic course offered by Red Cross and (you're right) doesn't require any actuakl swimming. I wouldn't look at it as a burden either, it does offer real good info that anyone that ever "gets wet" should really know anyway.

As far as Community First Aid, it took the place of the old RC Basic First Aid and is much more in depth and is a 9.5 hour course (as opposed to 4 for the other one). Again, call the Red Cross, or your local EMS outfit, most will offer some class schedule for this course. Some colleges or local Adult ED centers may offer it too.

My guess is that they will NOT let you substitute the Basic for the Community courses, just due to the fact that so much more is covered in Community course. Hope that helps.

 

[TomEske]

Thanks again for al the good suggestions. I guess I'll just have to hit the phones and get the straightest answers I can from the State.
Mavs: My local ARC does not offer community First Aid, they only offer the Basic (which you refer to as "old"), and of course CPR. I have the cards for both, which I took just a few months ago. Now I'm wondering why they are teaching "old" courses. Also, I've been told by many that Community Water Safety is no longer being offered by the ARC. So I am truly confused.
Are you certified to teach CWS? If so, maybe we can get together and I'll bring the beer and pretzels.
Tom

 

[iceNsnow]

right on rafting guy!

I agree that keeping the requirements up to date is a real hassle!!

 

[mavs00]

Mavs: My local ARC does not offer community First Aid, they only offer the Basic (which you refer to as "old"), and of course CPR. I have the cards for both, which I took just a few months ago. Now I'm wondering why they are teaching "old" courses. Also, I've been told by many that Community Water Safety is no longer being offered by the ARC. So I am truly confused.
Are you certified to teach CWS? If so, maybe we can get together and I'll bring the beer and pretzels.
Tom

Confusion????? Are you kidding. the Red Cross is infamous for changing things mid-stream and coming up with new fancy titles and course work. Instructors often have little clue as to changes until way after they've been instituted.

As far as CFA. It may just be a matter of verbiage. Community First Aid is the standard and basic first aid that is offered nowadays (just looked at my book). It came out a few years ago and it took the place of what was called Standard First Aid (which was often referred to as Basic First Aid). A lot of "old schoolers" still refer to Community First Aid as Basic First Aid because that's what is it, just fancier. Check your certification, if you took it recently, it may in fact be (and likely is) Community First Aid. Whatever the case, it's the 9-hour standard First Aid Course offered through the RC.

Same story with Community Water Safety. As far as I'm aware, it certainly is still available. Like I said before, it may be tough to find a course, as it's not in real high demand. Most water people lean towards the higher levels like Lifeguard training or basic swim instruction that requires actual water work. Still, I believe any Water Safety Instructor (like myself) can teach that course. Personally, I've never taught it so I'd have to double check with the RC to find out for sure.

Most water related RC courses are NOT offered through the RC itself (in our area anyway). The RC trains the instructors, and provides course material, but the courses are offered at and through other venues (like colleges, community pools, HS, etc.). If your Local RC seems clueless, try calling a larger chapter in a CITY nearby.

 

[raftingguy]

When I took Basic Water Safety through the Red Cross, it was a one day course, half of which was spent in the water.

 

[TomEske]

Yes raftingguy thats right, but basic water safety is a totally different course then community water safety. Community water safety requires no water work, I have since confirmed, however it is no longer offered either. I have yet to contact the DEC directly and find out what is acceptable now. I did talk to a Ranger I spent part of the day with on Saturday, and he wasn't up on what goes and what doesn't. Not many guide/ranger interactions here in the Catskills like there are in the daks.
Work is nuts just now, but when I get a free hour I'll start calling the State and running their phone gauntlet to see what I can learn.
Tom

 

[raftingguy]

Contact Amy McKelvey, she is in charge of the licensing program and she is very helpful. Her number is 518-402-8838.