Cat? Maybe bear? Chocorua

[erugs]

Friend Brian and I were hiking on the Hammond Trail yesterday morning when, about an hour in, I noticed a spot of fresh blood (about the size of a dime) on a green leaf on the trailbed. I thought it odd, and wondered what it might be from. Brian wasn't bleeding; neither was I. Then I thought that it reminded me of when I had a dog in heat and she'd leave spots like that on the kitchen floor. Hmmmmm. Maybe a coyote or fox in heat? About 20 feet up the trail we had our answer: a newborn fawn lay dead on the trail. The body wasn't bloody or gored, except that it's head was missing. A while later we saw a ranger on the trail and mentioned it to her. She suggested possibly a bear had made the kill. I suggested cat, since my house cats decapitate the mice they catch. She agreed that would be a possibility. The body was still there about four hours later when we returned, though now the white spots on the fur were barely visible due to the enormous number of huge flies. Gross, for sure. What do you think?

 

[Gris]

Chupalabra...

 

[Chip]

Nature is gross, it's just usually not left on a trail for prime viewing.
I doubt it was a bear. I vote bobcat, especially since it was killed and not eaten. Cats will kill for "fun".

 

[clg898]

Bears will kill, leave, and return later when feeling hungry...

 

[erugs]

I'm still curious about this so I wrote to Ben Kilham, a bear expert from the Lyme region. He responded "It wasn't a bear for several reasons: They enter carcasses through the belly as they don't have teeth that cut hide. They would take the fawn with them to heavy cover to eat, and if there were remains, they would bury them to keep it away from other scavengers and to prevent the flies from lying eggs. They would return to finish the meal. Coyotes, fox and fisher all eat fawn when they can." Ben is author of "Among the Bears: Raising Orphan Cubs in the Wild."

 

[Chip]

I'm still curious about this so I wrote to Ben Kilham, a bear expert from the Lyme region. He responded "It wasn't a bear for several reasons: They enter carcasses through the belly as they don't have teeth that cut hide. They would take the fawn with them to heavy cover to eat, and if there were remains, they would bury them to keep it away from other scavengers and to prevent the flies from lying eggs. They would return to finish the meal. Coyotes, fox and fisher all eat fawn when they can." Ben is author of "Among the Bears: Raising Orphan Cubs in the Wild."

This contradicts Ben Kilham. so who knows. If you believe the PA Game Comm. then your observation would be consistant with a bear. If it was a bear it had just happened and the bear was probably VERY close.

 

[chuck]

Several years ago we were rock hopping up Nineteen mile brook and came across small deer torn up like this but its body was mostly in the water. It looked pretty fresh. I was with my kids so I wanted to move on incase we interupted someones meal.

 

[erugs]

That's an interesting link, Chip, but I don't think it really negates what Ben wrote. In this case, no animal was lurking, as the untouched remains (except for the abundant flies) were still there hours later, and the trail was not heavily travelled that day -- one other group was behind us. The fact that there was no damage to the body, except that the head was gone, and neatly chomped at that, and the surrounding area was not bloody or disturbed at all (I looked for tracks and only saw that one drop of blood and a little bit of black gooey "stuff" on the trail, makes me think it wasn't bear. But I don't know. My guess remains that it was from the wildcat family.

 

[sardog1]

This contradicts Ben Kilham. so who knows. If you believe the PA Game Comm. then your observation would be consistant with a bear. If it was a bear it had just happened and the bear was probably VERY close.

Actually, Parts I and II of the PA article taken together support Ben Kilham. Page down on Part I to Part II, where you'll find this very interesting tidbit (sorry, I couldn't resist):

Coyotes will sometimes decapitate a fawn, carry the head a considerable distance, and feed on it in isolation (O’Gara 1978).

 

[SAR-EMT40]

If the head was missing and there wasn't tons of blood around than it was killed somewhere else and was being moved or it was dead already when the head was removed from the body. Arterial bleeds like that would have spurted gobs of blood everywhere.

Cats almost always drag their kill off and will typically cover it with grass or the like. The method of disposal of the animal doesn't sound like any animal that I am familiar with.

I have seen what I thought was probably a bear kill or scavenge of a deer carcass in the dacks'. It was only off the trail 20 or 30 feet as I remember and painfully close to the avalache shelter I was in alone that night. It was winter and the carcass was frozen solid so I wasn't too worried that he was going to come back tonight. Of course I also wasn't sure it wasn't bigfoot that killed it.

Keith

 

[SAR-EMT40]

Coyotes will sometimes decapitate a fawn, carry the head a considerable distance, and feed on it in isolation (O’Gara 1978).

This is interesting. Reading Paul Rezendes book leads me to believe that only the Coyotes that are lowest in the pecking order would eat the head because that is one of the last things along with the leg ends and spine that would be left.

This is based upon Pauls actually witnessing the eating of a deer kill and observing the pecking order and the way it was consumed.

But again the only thing missing was the head. This is strange.

Keith

 

[funkyfreddy]

But again the only thing missing was the head. This is strange.

Could it be voodoo or some sick sort of prank? I've heard of this being done with chickens or goats.....

 

[erugs]

The ranger we spoke to said that "the brain is high in protein." Odd thing is that on the way out, after seeing the remains of the fawn for the second time, all we could think of was heading (pun intended) to the car and going for a Pig's Ear ( just a coincidence).

 

[spider solo]

I would also think that finding the fawn out in the open along the trail that whatever was going on was interupted and scared off for awhile.
I think it was done by wildlife...still the only species that I know that routinely collects heads is....homo sapiens

 

[forestgnome]

Agree with SARdog and SAR-EMT40, the fawn was killed elsewhere. It was being moved and hikers, perhaps errugles and Brian, probably scared away whatever was moving it. I've seen tracks of lynx on Mt Chocorua, and of corse there are plenty of coyotes and bears, as well as bobcats in the area.

 

[Mattl]

My bets are on a bear. I have heard numerous reports of them doing that. Knowing that bears may not do that to a very large dear, this was a fawn so he may have been able to eat the head. Because the most fat is there, a bear will eat the head off fish and small mammals then come back for the rest if it gets time. It may have been dragging the carcass then got scared away by something. I cannot see a coyote just eating the head since I would think they would more go for the middle of the deer. Interesting if it were proven for a lynx since I know they are in the Whites. -Mattl

 

[SAR-EMT40]

My problem understanding this is that a bear is big and strong enough that it would have no trouble running away with a fawn in its mouth without having to drop it if it was suprised. With the exception of one reliable source I had never heard of a head being eaten first by any predator. This still suprises me. Again, I am more asking questions, not making statements. Anything other than a bear IMHO might drop the animal if startled by the appearance of a human(s) while it was on the trail. I am more inclined to believe that the head was severed where the animal was killed (explains the lack of blood) and the body was being carried (maybe more like dragged) away by a predator (anything other than a bear ) when it was suprised by you inconsiderate humans separating him from his lunch. I would think you should have been able to feel the eyes on you.

Again, this is my guess, not to be taken as anything but a guess.

A Postscrpt. It was mentioned in the original post that the first hint was a drop or two of blood. That would mean that the source of the blood would have had to be off of the ground. So at least the whole animal wasn't being dragged. Maybe none of it was. Again, this is an interesting one.

Its too bad Mavs wasn't around. I believe this is his realm.


Keith