WMNF Trail Maintenance

[RickB.]

I'm posting to let everyone know that OP Giff is in the process of getting a user name and, as such, can't respond yet. But we don't want to let the original concept he voiced get lost or lose momentum.
Thanks for all the interest!

 

[peakn]

Is the list of trails up for adoption in WV published on-line? I'm sure if you posted a link on this site you'd attract some interest. I generally participate in volunteer trail work activities 3 times per year maintaining trails at Cardigan. This Saturday & Sunday (10/25, 10/26) is one of those weekends. We'll primarily be grooming ski trails this weekend, but also do work on hiking trails. All interested folks are welcome. (Including walk-ins). There's plenty of experienced crew leaders to provide training in whatever work is being done. I've been doing this for many years now, but still pick up new insight each time I go. I think it'd be good if adopters posted trip reports on their maintenance activities just to make it known that this is happening (and that it's fun!).

That's a great idea Ray. Unfortunately it is not online as of this time. However, it will be a priority of mine to have that on the WVAIA website before next Spring- www.wvaia.org

Thanks Ray

Harry

 

[mtnpa]

I would be happy to help.
I'd be willing to coordinate a crew and take on a trail USFS thinks needs attention.
Anyone want to join me?

 

[cooperhill]

I'm in. Thanks mtnpa.

 

[giff]

Clarification

Thanks for the interest out there. I probably should have waited until the Spring when it is really time to do the bulk of Level 1 maintenance. If any one who is interested to reply to me directly at [email protected] or post to this thread that would be good. I will compile a list of names and get things organized in the Spring.

To address a few of the concerns.

1. If you sign a volunteer agreement with the FS you are covered by insurance. There is even a benefit. If you do 16 hours of work in a year you get a free parking sticker.

2. If you just go out on your own and then post that you have done some maintenance I don't think there are any issues, but you obviously wouldn't be covered by insurance.

3. The only tools you really need are a bow saw (or something similar) and a fire rake. Actually a heavy garden rake would work. If some one needs to borrow a rake or a saw, I should be able to arrange that, but it would require a volunteer agreement.

4. Once the work is done if you could post information about blow downs that you couldn't clear and any other issues, like major erosion, that would help the Forest Service to take the appropriate action,

Thanks for your help.

 

[SilentCal]

A parking sticker is a nice perk. I wish the AMC did that for my trail work.

 

[MadRiver]

A parking sticker is a nice perk. I wish the AMC did that for my trail work.

I believe they do. I was asked if I needed a parking sticker and I do not so I declined. I know the AMC tries to limit the number that they give out since they have to buy them, yet if your parking area that you use to do trail work requires one, you should ask. Alex’s predecessor was the one who asked if I needed the pass.

 

[RoySwkr]

3. The only tools you really need are a bow saw (or something similar) and a fire rake. Actually a heavy garden rake would work.

I'm not sure what WVAIA trails are like, but in IMHO the single most useful and necessary tool for basic maintenance in wooded areas is hand pruners - nearly any trail in the WMNF could use a full day of work with them and some much more. If you're serious about trail work, get the heavy duty kind than can cut 2" and you'll hardly ever need to saw a branch. Even the dollar store one-hand pruner is better than nothing, and I've seen a woman with arm in cast do a day of trail work with hand pruners.

For my section of LT/AT in VT, I carry a folding saw in my pack as there's usually less than 1 thing per mile that needs sawing. If something larger falls, I cut off the branches and move it but every few years need to bring a larger saw or ax next visit or request a chain saw. A rake would be useless for clearing waterbars on that section - some get full of mud and require a genuine shovel and others are narrow and are best done with a hoe. If you get stuck with waterbars that haven't been cleared in awhile, you may need a mattock to dig them open.

Above all, carry only one tool in your hands and tie the less-frequently-used on your pack. People with multiple tools often walk right by stuff that's an easy task if your tool is out. Multiple trail workers can carry different tools, if you're by yourself and returning the same way carry a different tool each direction.

 

[Jason Berard]

That sounds like exactly the system I use, Roy. I think it saves a lot of time.

 

[Dr. Dasypodidae]

Thanks for the interest out there. I probably should have waited until the Spring when it is really time to do the bulk of Level 1 maintenance. If any one who is interested to reply to me directly at [email protected] or post to this thread that would be good. I will compile a list of names and get things organized in the Spring.

To address a few of the concerns.

1. If you sign a volunteer agreement with the FS you are covered by insurance. There is even a benefit. If you do 16 hours of work in a year you get a free parking sticker.

2. If you just go out on your own and then post that you have done some maintenance I don't think there are any issues, but you obviously wouldn't be covered by insurance.

3. The only tools you really need are a bow saw (or something similar) and a fire rake. Actually a heavy garden rake would work. If some one needs to borrow a rake or a saw, I should be able to arrange that, but it would require a volunteer agreement.

4. Once the work is done if you could post information about blow downs that you couldn't clear and any other issues, like major erosion, that would help the Forest Service to take the appropriate action,

Thanks for your help.

Thanks for organizing this effort, giff, something that I think is very much needed. I thought that the USFS stopped issuing parking passes to trail mainentance volunteers, but perhaps that was just for those working through other organizations, such as AMC or DOC? Do all USFS White Mountain districts have a volunteer trail maintenance program, or just the Pemi district out of Holderness?

I believe that the AMC professional trail crew primarily does the "heavy-lifting" and big project work, leaving the level one maintenance for volunteers, similar to the volunteer work that Steve Maratin and I do for the DOC under Jason Berard's direction. Steve and I use many of the same techniques mentioned above for the Glen Cliff Trail, which we adopted under the auspices of DOC ten years ago, as we clip back branches and remove blowdowns on the way up, usually make a quick trip to the summit of Moosilauke , then leap frog cleaning over 200 water bars with mattocks on the way down. This fall season, I plan to bring along a conventional leaf rake to remove leaves just upslope of the water bars, as these leaves commonly get washed into the bars soon after cleaning.

I will add that fall cleaning of water bars is just as important as spring cleaning of water bars, if not more so, as if you can get the leaves removed before the winter rain, snow, and ice occurs, the water bars will work better during snowpack melt in the spring, when the water bars are still buried and inaccessbile to cleaning.

Lots of great ideas so far on this thread. Some folks report on blowdowns and the like in the trail CONDITIONS section of VFTT, but perhaps a new section could be set up for trail maintenance, as I suggested with a post a couple of years ago (this suggestions was pretty much dismissed as unworkable at the time ).

Roy, I believe that the long-time AMC adopters of the Wildcat Ridge Trail retired this fall, so hoping that the new adopters take a more activist approach, as indeed this section of the AT is in deplorable condition, yet my guess is that free rides up on the gondola could be negotiated with Wildcat Ski area, and perhaps even free or at least reduced rates negotiated to stay at Carter Notch hut?

 

[Abster]

Where Do I Sign-up?

I'm with Mtn Pa - I would enjoy spending a day cleaning-up a trail. Can we assemble a crew within the next few weeks - or before Thanksgiving? I would need to do this early in the week and imagine that a week day would be better because it is slower time for hikers to come through the clean-up area.

Anyone else?

Hanna

 

[1HappyHiker]

Do all USFS White Mountain districts have a volunteer trail maintenance program, or just the Pemi district out of Holderness?

The Forest Service website (Click HERE) would seem to indicate that their trail-maintenance volunteer program is system-wide. One of my Forest Service adopted trails is administered by the Saco District, and so there is at least one other WMNF district that participates in this program other than the Pemi district. And although I'm not 100% certain, I'm fairly certain that the Androscoggin district also participates in this program.

 

[giff]

Thanks for the support

I am glad to see all of the interest. With winter quickly closing in I am afraid that trail maintenance is done for the year. I will keep a list of all of you who have shown interest and get back to you in the Spring as well as repost to the community at large. During the winter I will compile a list of trails in the Pemi-Baker district that need adopting. If anyone else is interested, please email me at and I will be sure to get back to you.

 

[Jazzbo]

Here's an idea. One possible angle might be to harness energies of some of our VFTT power-hikers to brush some remote interior wilderness trail to better define the trail within FS wilderness guidelines. Might devote a couple of days to some remote trail .... different trails each year. If done right could be good occasion for a VFTT gathering type event. If well done might not need re-visiting many years. Could be orgainized in different venue each year. Organizers could Geo-cache Mountain Dew's for the crew. Of course we need to limit size of such a group to no greater than 10.

 

[RoySwkr]

One possible angle might be to harness energies of some of our VFTT power-hikers to brush some remote interior wilderness trail to better define the trail within FS wilderness guidelines. Might devote a couple of days to some remote trail .... different trails each year.

I think that's a great idea, since I wouldn't have to do anything

I believe the Wilderness guidelines say trails are still to be brushed 4' wide but just not as frequently, so a one-time event would fit perfectly

 

[1HappyHiker]

I believe the Wilderness guidelines say trails are still to be brushed 4' wide but just not as frequently, so a one-time event would fit perfectly

One of my adopted trails is in the Great Gulf Wilderness. Below is a copy of a page from the Adopter’s Handbook. Would you believe that the “Trail Width” should be no more than 18 inches?! So, for my wilderness trail, that’s the standard I adhere to, but admittedly it seems pretty darn narrow!!

 

[rocket21]

Would you believe that the “Trail Width” should be no more than 18 inches?! So, for my wilderness trail, that’s the standard I adhere to, but admittedly it seems pretty darn narrow!!

I have a solution - we can measure 18" using the same measuring tools ski areas use to measure new snow

 

[Hillwalker]

Trail Width

Actually the treadway width is 18 inches, but the total "brushed out" width is 48 inches and 96 inches overhead clearance. Here is a link to the USFS Standards for trail construction and maintenance.

http://search.isp.netscape.com/nsis...fs.fed.us/database/acad/dev/trails/trails.htm

In my USFS Trail construction and maintenence training back in 1983 and workshops over the past 25 years of maintaining and trail construction and AT relocations we were told that you should picture yourself carrying a sheet of 4 by 8 plywood standing on end broadside down the trail and that is how the trail should be brushed out.

 

[1HappyHiker]

Actually the treadway width is 18 inches, but the total "brushed out" width is 48 inches and 96 inches overhead clearance. Here is a link to the USFS Standards for trail construction and maintenance.

http://search.isp.netscape.com/nsis...fs.fed.us/database/acad/dev/trails/trails.htm

In my USFS Trail construction and maintenence training back in 1983 and workshops over the past 25 years of maintaining and trail construction and AT relocations we were told that you should picture yourself carrying a sheet of 4 by 8 plywood standing on end broadside down the trail and that is how the trail should be brushed out.

Hmmm! This Monday I’ll try to get some clarification.

_ We’ve got your documentation (which I respect).

_ Then we have a statement in the AMC Trail Adopter’s Handbook about the brushing standard for AMC trails that are in Wilderness Areas. It reads: “The brushing standard is different. Trails should be brushed minimally. Your brushing should reflect the minimum needed for a hiker to pass through. Trail width should be no more than 18 inches.”

_ And, in my personal files, I have an e-mail from AMC (shown below) which states: “We do try to maintain a rough 3 foot by 6 foot corridor in Wilderness and leave any blowdowns that are easy over and easy under.”

-----Original Message-----
From: Alex DeLucia [mailto:adeluciaAToutdoors.org]
Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2007 5:08 PM
To: compton
Cc: Monroe, Scott; barbarakuklaATmsn.com
Subject: Re: Adopter Work Report: Osgood Cut-Off

John,

Thanks for the report on Osgood Cut-Off. That is an early season trip!

I have not been out there yet this year, but I did get a call from Brian Johnston from the US Forest Service about the Osgood Cut-Off. Not a big deal, but Brian had said that maybe the corridor was cut a little too wide for Wilderness standards. We do try to maintain a rough 3 foot by 6 foot corridor in Wilderness and leave any blowdowns that are easy over and easy under.

I am sorry for not taking the time to talk with you about Wilderness standards when you picked up this second trail.


Thanks,

-Alex

Alexander R. DeLucia
AMC North Country Trails
Volunteer Programs Supervisor
P.O. Box 298 RT 16
Gorham, NH 03581
603-466-2721 x192
Fax: 603-466-2822
adeluciaAToutdoors.org
www.outdoors.org

 

[RoySwkr]

Would you believe that the “Trail Width” should be no more than 18 inches?! So, for my wilderness trail, that’s the standard I adhere to, but admittedly it seems pretty darn narrow!!

I agree with Hillwalker that means for the footway, the previous sentence is "Your brushing should reflect the minimum necessary for a hiker to pass through." Obviously some adopters take that to mean no brushing is necessary since you can push through even if branches are touching, while my take would be that any branch touching a backpacker passing through should be trimmed.

Some people in the GMC claim that brushing need be only 18" at your foot level and get wider at body and pack level. Of course if you cut it only 18" wide it will soon be too narrow and you will have to cut every branch twice a year which is impossible on a wooded trail of any length. Since you are supposed to trim branches only at joints or at the trunk, your actual cut can be wider. The president of one trail club I know of uses a "Five Year" standard - any branch he trims he cuts back far enough so that it won't need to be trimmed again for 5 years, hence the setback varies depending on how long ago each branch was trimmed. And the trail actually looks more natural with a ragged edge than if you cut a narrow fixed-width tunnel.

I looked in the Forest Plan and couldn't find the trail maintenance standards by zone that I thought were there.
http://www.fs.fed.us/r9/forests/white_mountain/projects/forest_plan/index.php