Are you a victim of the Ultra-lite craze?

[KMartman]

You are making my point about the word ultralight being marketed and attached to gear that is really not that light at all. 2.6lbs is not ultralight compared to 4lbs, though it is lighter.



The SD website describes the Origami Ultralight as a 1 person, 3 season shelter...I didn't really get into the specs, but it does look much bigger than a 1 person job. Nice catch.

For 3, 2.6lbs isn't bad, compared to a tent, but not compared to several tarps made by ID(Sil Tarp 2 or 3), Golite or Gossamergear. They are lighter, and can be found for close to $120 like the SD tarp. SilTarps on Ebay, such as the SilTarp 3, sell for no more than $100.

This is the Sierra Designs I am referring to...2.6 lbs...sleeps 2-3 PEOPLE...thats a great weight IMHO for something that sleeps that many. Granted there is lighter, but likely NOT CHEAPER...check the price..(with the exception of the few you mention)..

http://www.campmor.com/webapp/wcs/st...0226&langId=-1

What is the "weight" it has to be for you to consider it "ultralight"..? Like I said ....from 4 down to 2 seems pretty ultralight.

M

[Frosty]

"...more in tune with your body..."
I can't stop laughing at that one. Whenever I hear a phrase like that, I think someone's gonna offer me a hit from a bong and yell, "dude, play Freebird again!" Priceless. You just made my day!

Glad to help. Though consider that if you lay off the bong then maybe you will be able to tell the difference when weight is removed from your pack. Or not.

I still don't see what the problem is, though, if some people want to carry less weight. Or if they want to carry more weight. You don't have to buy anything especially light or heavy.

And there is a lot of non-light gear out there. Including stuff sacks. Plenty of heavy duty stuff sacks for those who don't like silnylon. Myself, I found them (silnylon) to be fine. Have yet to wear one out, and they are much more water resisitant than my old ones.

[Chip]

I think it all goes deeper than most here are ready to admit . There are notable exceptions, so I'll use myself as an example: Gear acquisition and upgrades are my attempts at achieving some sort of perfection in one aspect of my measley and profane mortal existence.
I don't get out as often as I'd like, probably only one weekend every 3 or 4 weeks. That leaves a lot of down-time to think about my next outing. When I do get out there I want to be as light, dry, warm, well-fed and comfortable as possible within the limitations defined by my body and backpack. So doing better at that makes me feel good. AND (here's the Psycho Social deficiencies part) if I'm lighter, dryer, warmer, more well fed and comfortable than my hiking partner, that makes me feel better . (except when I take the kids out - they're always warmer, dryer and better fed than me.)

Golfers buy better clubs when they'd probably be better off spending the money on lessons. Fisherman buy faster boats and more lures when they'd probably be better off learning more about the piece of water they're on. The injured would prefer a pill or an injection when what they really need to do is lose 20 pounds and get more exercise. I'd probably be a better backpacker if I got out more often, but I do what I can, you know ?

[timmus]

Oh, that's just a few ounces. I bet you can get rid of over 90% of the mass you got. I'm thinking -- get your body weight down to about 5 or 10 lbs.

-Dr. Wu

I found THIS on the Internet, is it what you're talking about ???

[Gris]

It makes sense to shave pounds if you are multi-day hiking. Not so if you're day hiking - shouldnt need that much. The day hikers who buy ultralight stuff are the "victims" - of their own lack of awareness i suppose...

[jade]

I see no need for the corners on the mouth...just one layer of duct tape would do...now that's ultra light!

[timmus]

I see no need for the corners on the mouth...just one layer of duct tape would do...now that's ultra light!

The corners of the mouth are needed so we see how PROUD of himself the guy is

[Frosty]

It makes sense to shave pounds if you are multi-day hiking. Not so if you're day hiking - shouldnt need that much. The day hikers who buy ultralight stuff are the "victims" - of their own lack of awareness i suppose...

Again, it depends on what you want to do. Long days, high miles, lots of elevation gain... if you like that, not that I do, but if that is your goal, then a heavy day pack will interfere with your plans. If you're just climbing a peak to have a picnic, go ahead and carry a cooler if you want.

Some people simply enjoy ther hike more if they carry a lighter weight. Others like to carry "just in case" stuff, or like their stuff to be more durable. So what?

I just don't see the need to make the "other" side to be wrong in order for your side to be "right."

As Kipling said,
"There are nine and sixty ways
Of constructing tribal lays,
And every single one of them is right."

[sli74]

I just don't see the need to make the "other" side to be wrong in order for your side to be "right."

SO VERY TRUE !!!!!!!!
Not only true here but true in many other circumstances.

sli74

[nazdarovye]

SO VERY TRUE !!!!!!!!
Not only true here but true in many other circumstances.

sli74

Absolutely.

I seriously don't understand what the original poster's beef is. If he's happy with his gear, good for him! We're all responsible for our own choices and for our own learning. And, most of all, our own actions. What others choose is up to them.

I also note that people often post that others are taken in by marketing hype, but never themselves. Kind of amusing (and presumptuous) when you really think about it.

[dvbl]

...I seriously don't understand what the original poster's beef is...

Time for me to bow out of this thread. I don't have time to explain it to you again. I'm sorry you didn't understand the point I was making. Several other folks understood. They didn't agree, but they got the point. When you said this in your first post..."I've certainly found that less pounds = more comfort."...that was a dead give-away. Take care, man. Happy trails, and may the good weather follow you.

Interesting what ruffles feathers...ultra-light and ill-behaved dogs. Like touching the proverbial third rail.

Gotta go get "in tune with my body." Thanks again, Frosty.

[whcobbs]

If your make your own light/ultralight gear you'll avoid the marketing trap, save some money, and learn a whole lot about gear. Not to mention participating in a supportive community via various websites and the satisfaction of personal handcraft.
Walt

[jjo]

Afraid I'm guilty of buying in the ultra lite idea when buying new gear. Having a bad back and Knee, every pound matters (I think) to me so i try to keep it down. So at least I'm doing it for practical reasons other than Marketing hype... Just bought a new first aid kit from REI and I went w the ultra light one (also waterproof) and weighed a little over 4 oz I think.

[Frosty]

Thanks again, Frosty.

Pleasure. (I ain't heavy, I'm your brother.)

Take care, man. Happy trails

[rhihn]

Yes, you have a point . . . I have pitched it in pretty heavy winds and it is has worked well enough MOST of the time. The biggest problem is getting it set up in the wind. It performs okay once it is set up but I have had some major problem getting it set up. Of course most of those problems were because I was solo and didn't have a second pair of hands to help out.

In 2004, soon after I began using the Squall exclusively, I tried pitching it in gusting winds at Outpost Camp on Mount Whitney, it took me an hour of struggling with it as it was blowing around. After trying everything I could and being unable to get it properly pitched, two very nice guys who got tired of amusing themselves with my tent pitching antics came over and offered to help me.

By then, I was ready to play damsel in distress (which if you know me is unbelievable most of the time) and with BOTH their help we were finally able to get it set up in that wind.

I had the same problem in Bryce Canyon where I was all alone at one of the campsites at the bottom of the canyon and struggled for 30+ minutes before ripping a hole in the tent vestibule, which still leaks to this day.

So, yes, the Squall has its limitations and the only problems it has ever caused me have been during hardcore wind "storms" . . .

When pitched properly, I have weathered some CRAZY rain storms in it and emerged dry . . . so wind is a problem, rain hasn't been that much of a problem.

sli74

Exactly what Seema said. We own the same tarptent. It works fine for us, but we had the same difficulty setting it up in wind in a recent Grand Canyon trip. But I've had the same problem with heavier tents as well. Other than that issue, we like it a lot. But's important for us to be comfortable with our gear, and not take one piece over another simply because it's lighter. We're gradually getting our gear weight down, but sometimes it's worth it to bring a few extra oz. or lbs., either for comfort or for survival. Going ultralite blindly without research, gradual initiation, etc., to learn what you can and can't do without, or want or don't want to do without, could cause some to make poor gear choices and either ruin their outdoor experience, or worse.

Dick