Jetboil?

My 1st stove purchase is still a ways off, but I'm starting to give it some thought. Anyone own or ever have experience w/ this piece?

http://www.campmor.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?memberId=12500226&productId=39149487

Matt

The Jetboil is very high on my list of "gear to buy" for the spring. A good friend of mine has one. Very light, all-in-one stove/mess kit. I wish they'd make a white gas version for winter, though.

Love mine - was the perfect gear purhase for my recent Northville-Placid thru-hike and I will carry exclusively during the spring/summer/fall seasons. Easy to use (screw on, turn nob, click auto igniter), light, fast boil times, compact storage profile, and depending on the food you bring with you... nothing to clean up afterwards.

I am a no nonsense type back country cooker.... if I cant pour boiled water into it to make it edible, I dont bring it... so this stove is sort of my dream stove.

Cons:

You wont be doing any fancy cooking with this.

Can be a strain on larger groups (but they now sell the "pot" part of the stove seperately so you can boil, switch, boil some more)

My Winter performance was sub par. The best of any cannister stove I've used in low temps... but that's not saying much.

Thanks for the input guys. I realize that this piece won't make it in winter, but that won't be an issue for a while.
Artex-maybe if they feel there's a demand, they will create a white gas version in the future.
Holdstrong-your description of this piece sounds like it would work for me. I'm a vegetarian, and would be looking mostly just to boil water for purification, tea, oatmeal, pasta, soup, stuff along those lines. I don't mind eating pretty simply when in the BC.
I still have to give this a lot of thought, but it's definitely on the short list for possible stove buys.

Matt

I own and use mine regularly. It has its pro & cons. I use the MSR fuel canisters in 20* weather. Though it doesn't fit inside the boiler. If you keep the can inside your jacket, no problem firing it up to boil your water. Lay it on snow for a couple of minutes, its useless until the can is warmed again. For 3 seasons, it is a fast, efficient stove. My friend Strider, who is leaving from Springer Mtn soon, has chosen this for his "default" stove.

jet boil rrocks!

i love mine, its super quick and light. i use it in conjunction with a nalgene fair share mug; only boiling water in the stove and using the mug to mix food and whatnot.

in winter i throw a wool sock over the mug to insulate it.

as for the jet boil in winter, its NOT white gas, but......last december at hermit lakes shelter we were able to use it while the temp hovered around 0 and -5. flare-ups were a problem until the stove was up and running. i kept the cannister near my body in my sleeping bag making sure it was warm as possible before cooking and then put a hand warmer under the cannister while cooking. this seemed to make a very big difference.

any wind, even a very light wind can be a problem and the jetboil does not come with a wind guard, so if you are cooking up a quick snack on summit or on the trail be prepared to figure a way to block the wind or bring something.

all in all its a great stove. i was hestitant at first buying a cannister stove due to all the extra trash created by using disposable cannisters, but in warm weather you can cook ALOT of meals from one cannister.

the starchild said:

i was hestitant at first buying a cannister stove due to all the extra trash created by using disposable cannisters, but in warm weather you can cook ALOT of meals from one cannister.

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So do non-canister stoves create less trash? How so? Are the white gas ones refillable or something?

Matt

mcorsar said:

So do non-canister stoves create less trash? How so? Are the white gas ones refillable or something?

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White gas is a liquid (Coleman fuel, purified gasoline). You just refill the tank on (or fuel bottle for) your stove.

Doug

DougPaul said:

White gas is a liquid (Coleman fuel, purified gasoline). You just refill the tank on (or fuel bottle for) your stove.
Doug

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Yes, it's liquid, but so what, it doesn't come out of the faucet. Typically it comes in 1 gallon cans sold at camping stores, etc. Considering the efficiency of canister stoves, I'd say there is as much or more waste to be dsisposed of with white gas. Thankfully, both types of containers are recyclable.

Pb

Papa Bear said:

Yes, it's liquid, but so what, it doesn't come out of the faucet. Typically it comes in 1 gallon cans sold at camping stores, etc. Considering the efficiency of canister stoves, I'd say there is as much or more waste to be dsisposed of with white gas. Thankfully, both types of containers are recyclable.

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A gallon can almost certainly has a higher ratio of fuel to metal than do the small butane canisters (by weight). The gallon can also need not be carried on the trail.

It is much harder to estimate the behind the scenes (raw material and manufacturing) waste of the fuels and packaging systems. The raw material and delivery wastes would still be a factor if white gas came out of a faucet.

Doug

DougPaul said:

A gallon can almost certainly has a higher ratio of fuel to metal than do the small butane canisters (by weight). The gallon can also need not be carried on the trail.

It is much harder to estimate the behind the scenes (raw material and manufacturing) waste of the fuels and packaging systems. The raw material and delivery wastes would still be a factor if white gas came out of a faucet.

Doug

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All true what you say. But it's not the fuel wt. to container weight that's important, it's the cooking potential to container weight. The Jet Boil, and in fact most canisters, can cook more food per weight of fuel than white gas by far. My experience is at least a factor of two. There are charts out there but I can't find them at the moment. The usual measure is how much fuel does it take to boil a liter of water (or other measure). I used to measure 1/4 oz to boil 2 cups of water with a pocket rocket. The Jet Boil, with it's heat exchanger is better than that, I think I read .18 oz. That's pretty incredible and is a big selling ppoint for the unit. So even if gas and liquid propane have similar energy densaity (say BTUs per oz.) it's the delivery system that will make a big difference.

But the bottom line is there is waste in either case. Just make sure you go to the extra trouble of bringing these things back to some recycling center. The canisters are more of a pain since most recycling centers will require you to puncture the canister (I don't blame them for that requirement). And in White gas's favor, those gallon containers have more potential for reuse (as opposed to recycling). But there is only so many you can keep in your garage wth kerosene, old crank case oil, etc. in them.

Reuse, recycle. Do it.

I had rather the pain finding this again, but here's some info on stove/fuel type to efficiency (note it does not take into account any efficiency gains the jetboil system may introduce, but it does have a spreadsheet for you to work numbers on your own):

http://zenstoves.net/StoveChoices.htm#Efficiency

Anyway, the theme to me is the stove kit weight over meals made is the main determinate in deciding one stove over the other. The above link pulls numbers from controlled conditions which is advantageous to cartridge stove as I find they are way wind sensitive. The jetboil is likely less wind sensitive.

I'm waiting for the integrated stove systems to mature a bit, I'd want a hanging feature in a system. MSR is working on an integrated tank white gas stove system due in a few years so such a thing is in the works. I'm hoping it's not too far off, my whisperlight is getting long in the tooth.

If you want to hold off on a stove purchase, build an alcohol stove, slow, light and just fine for most 3 season needs.

Warren,
That was great information you posted! My hiking partner is a kind of a "McGiver type and that should keep him busy reading on many a cold night.

Warren

Good link. And to be honest I hesitated in posting on this thread since I know stoves are always a contentious issue, almost religeous if you look at some bulletin boards. But the point I rasied wasn't the stove weight vs. fuel efficiency, important as that is to back packers, but the throw-away weight (fuel containers) vs. efficiency. That relates more to environmental issues, but is less relavent to the back paker's comfort.

I agree with Warren that it would be nice if some of the design improvements that went into the Jetboil (as compared to say the Pocket Rocket) could go into a white gas stove.

Isn't it true that whatever we buy, the next model that comes out is always better? So we wait and wait and never buy anything! So I'm thinking I'll buy the Jetboil now, and maybe replace it in 2 years with the super light atomic powered version. Whatever!

Pb

DougPaul said:

White gas is a liquid (Coleman fuel, purified gasoline). You just refill the tank on (or fuel bottle for) your stove.

Doug

Click to expand...

'nuff said! exactly what i was gonna say. Buying in bulk usually does save waste, but as others said the efficiency of the stove is a factor....and as i said the jetboil shines in this area.

The design of the heat exchange on the jetboil is wonderfully efficient and simple. I hope they really do fix the design though so that a frying pan with the same bottom will work on the stove...or would that be too good to be true?

Another canister concern i have always had is knowing how much is left over in the can and the fear of running out. But the jet boil cans are so small that carrying a second one isn't too bad, especially if one can is almost empty. maybe someday there will be a way to refill cans of that type.

i did notice last week that the jetboil cans say "winter mix." the cans i have do not. did they actually change the mix?

the starchild said:

'nuff said! exactly what i was gonna say. Buying in bulk usually does save waste, but as others said the efficiency of the stove is a factor....and as i said the jetboil shines in this area.

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Weight and ease of fuel managment are easy to understand, efficiency and utility are much harder and more variable (pot size, temps, wind, high heat vs simmer, durability, fuel availability, etc). And the trade-offs differ with the length of the trip--a higher energy density fuel can win on a long trip even if it requires a heavier stove etc. Reliability is also a factor in situations where a stove failure could be serious (eg winter).

I generally prefer liquid fuel stoves (white gas or alcohol), but there are many reasonable systems to choose from.

Doug

I second the "frying pan with the same bottom as the stove" idea!

really fast, watch out

I bought one last summer from ems for $65, man it worked to fast! Stupid me i wanted hot chocolate so i poured the powder in and added water. I swear i was fishing for 2-3 minutes then turned around and the whole thing was boiling over from the cover. Took me a good scrubbing to clean it and the outside foam shriveled up because of the boiling water all over it. I think it's a cool toy.

Jet Boil works really great if ya just wanna boil water. The fuel can has a tendency to perspire. So if ya pack it up fast its worth tossing it in a baggie first so it doesn't create any rust in the bottom of your unit where it stores.

Coleman

Warren Wrote "I'm waiting for the integrated stove systems to mature a bit, I'd want a hanging feature in a system. MSR is working on an integrated tank white gas stove system"

I have used a coleman feather 442 stove for fifteen years now. It uses white gas or gasoline and has a flip down tri-pod system. It never failed me in any weather for twelve years. The generator finally failed and i replaced it for twelve bucks. I think it will be another twelve years before i have a problem again. One tankful lasts me a weekend (fri. night sat morn and night, sunday morning) with plenty to spare. its a great integrated system.

Mike