adkleaddog
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how 'bout "Exponentially"
Confirmed Gray Wolf in Adirondacks
- Thread starter Sixer
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how 'bout "Exponentially"
Rob S
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For anyone who is interested ........
http://www.lakotawolf.com/
This place is about 20 minutes from my house. I haven't been there yet, but have been meaning to go. This thread, albeit going downhill, has renewed my interest.
The Lakota Wolf Preserve allows you to watch and photograph wolves in an environment that is much more natural than a typical zoo.
If anyone fellow VFTTers would like to go sometime, just drop me an email or PM. The Delaware Water Gap and the Appalachian Trail are less than 10 minutes away, so we could plan a hike as well.
Rob
(Mavs, once again you have spoken eloquently ........... and I agree 100%.)
http://www.lakotawolf.com/
This place is about 20 minutes from my house. I haven't been there yet, but have been meaning to go. This thread, albeit going downhill, has renewed my interest.
The Lakota Wolf Preserve allows you to watch and photograph wolves in an environment that is much more natural than a typical zoo.
If anyone fellow VFTTers would like to go sometime, just drop me an email or PM. The Delaware Water Gap and the Appalachian Trail are less than 10 minutes away, so we could plan a hike as well.
Rob
(Mavs, once again you have spoken eloquently ........... and I agree 100%.)
Barry Sr
Team Member
Shadow,
I disagree with your concept of of my life.
We could have a better understanding of each other in person and if that ever occurs, I will be glad to share back and forth all day. Many things can be taken out context on line.
I respect you for speaking your mind.
Respectfully,
Barry
I disagree with your concept of of my life.
We could have a better understanding of each other in person and if that ever occurs, I will be glad to share back and forth all day. Many things can be taken out context on line.
I respect you for speaking your mind.
Respectfully,
Barry
shadowcat
New member
Barry
Thank you for your reply. I will be the 1st to admit I can be very passionate about my feelings on matters such as this. I don't mean to offend you but it does make me sad that you or anyone can kill our wildlife. I don't get it and I never will. You seem like a nice person but I will stick with my suggestion of your switching to a camera instead of a gun.
and, this thread is not deteriorating it's expanding. that's what they do - go off in all directions. if they didn't they wouldn't be so interesting or informative.
Thank you for your reply. I will be the 1st to admit I can be very passionate about my feelings on matters such as this. I don't mean to offend you but it does make me sad that you or anyone can kill our wildlife. I don't get it and I never will. You seem like a nice person but I will stick with my suggestion of your switching to a camera instead of a gun.
and, this thread is not deteriorating it's expanding. that's what they do - go off in all directions. if they didn't they wouldn't be so interesting or informative.
shadowcat
New member
duh
bob bob bob
don't be a dufus you "should" know what i meant. geez
i've done quite a bit of work researching how animals are raised for food these days. if you have read any of the books i did on this subject you would understand my comment. be sure i know animals don't magically appear on your plates at dinner time.
bob bob bob
don't be a dufus you "should" know what i meant. geez
i've done quite a bit of work researching how animals are raised for food these days. if you have read any of the books i did on this subject you would understand my comment. be sure i know animals don't magically appear on your plates at dinner time.
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rondak46
New member
just checking....
... is fishing Ok in your book, Shadowcat?
Miike
... is fishing Ok in your book, Shadowcat?
Miike
shadowcat
New member
fishin..
i guess my response to that would be that the fascination of hunting (fishing) as a sport depends almost wholly on whether you are at the right or wrong end of a gun (rod).
i will also say i am far from perfect but i try really hard to live my beliefs which may or may not be agreed upon by others.& in times have left me to fend for myself.
"And there comes a time when one must take a position that is neither safe, nor political, nor popular, but he must take it because his conscience tells him that it is right. "
--Martin Luther King Jr.
i guess my response to that would be that the fascination of hunting (fishing) as a sport depends almost wholly on whether you are at the right or wrong end of a gun (rod).
i will also say i am far from perfect but i try really hard to live my beliefs which may or may not be agreed upon by others.& in times have left me to fend for myself.
"And there comes a time when one must take a position that is neither safe, nor political, nor popular, but he must take it because his conscience tells him that it is right. "
--Martin Luther King Jr.
Jaytrek57
New member
Shadow...interesting quote by Froude.
http://www.primatefreedom.com/chimpanzees/
Also there is documented evidence that killer whales "play" with their kills. By "play" I mean slowly tear apart a seal, toss it in the air and then discard the body (just leave it). There are tons of other examples in the animal world.
I am not a hunter...more of an amateur animal behaviorists...hey..everyone needs a hobby.
Wolves are so cool and have long been a favorite of mine...I hope they are coming down from Canada and then perhaps further conservation/preservation efforts can be made if this is the case.
This link may/may not have you rethink that position.
http://www.primatefreedom.com/chimpanzees/
Also there is documented evidence that killer whales "play" with their kills. By "play" I mean slowly tear apart a seal, toss it in the air and then discard the body (just leave it). There are tons of other examples in the animal world.
I am not a hunter...more of an amateur animal behaviorists...hey..everyone needs a hobby.
Wolves are so cool and have long been a favorite of mine...I hope they are coming down from Canada and then perhaps further conservation/preservation efforts can be made if this is the case.
Barry Sr
Team Member
Bob said:
Be nice, The shadowcat has a right to her opinion.
We don't agree but I'll defend her right to feel that way.
"... First thing I slayed...I was nine years old. It was a squirrel, these ladies were feeding it, you know, and I said, 'excuse me, bam.' No it wasn't a pet squirrel. I had it stuffed and petted it for years after that." - WRIF-FM, Detroit, Ted Nugent as guest D.J., September 26, 1991
Ted
Ted
Barry Sr
Team Member
maineguy said:
evil 1- I am not a mind reader
2- I'll stop being a dufus as long as you stop making asinine statements about 'mass produced' meat.
Do you use words like dufus in your 'books'.
Are these fairy tales that you write?
Yeah, but not to name calling. Typical response from someone of her 'stature'.
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rtrimarc
Member
The Meatrix
I am not putting in my 2 cents. I think all these issues have two sides, and there is no right or wrong answer. Obviously cruelty to animals is not encouraged by anyone(most), but the rights and wrongs of hunting will be debated forever. And who is, and who is not a dufus will also be an issue for the ages.
I was passed this link today, and it obviously comes from a group with certain ideals, which i may or may not agree with. This is passed along for entertainment and informative use only, but it is good...
http://www.themeatrix.com/
RVT
I am not putting in my 2 cents. I think all these issues have two sides, and there is no right or wrong answer. Obviously cruelty to animals is not encouraged by anyone(most), but the rights and wrongs of hunting will be debated forever. And who is, and who is not a dufus will also be an issue for the ages.
I was passed this link today, and it obviously comes from a group with certain ideals, which i may or may not agree with. This is passed along for entertainment and informative use only, but it is good...
http://www.themeatrix.com/
RVT
rondak46
New member
There is a right answer....
.. Man has been hunting animals forever, and always will. It is as it should be and there is nothing wrong with that.. whether you believe God crated us or if you believe evolution made us the way we are; the fact of the matter is that we are all food for each other. That is a matter of fact. WIld game is, to some, the, most delicious meat, or the finest furs (do you have leather shoes or a handbag). Should these people give up these things that they like because you think that animals should only be killed an a slaughterhouse?
Shadowcat says "We don't HAVE to hunt and kill to feed and cloth our familys". so am I supposed to feel fortunate that I can buy clothes made from Saudi Oil, that goes to china, so a child can make my clothes instead of going to school? And, Because this is an option, am I now an outlaw for filling my own freezer?
Some people think that they are better people because they do not see these animals killed. That is absurd. People who have a warm squishy feeling for mammals tend not to grant the good feeling to fish in the streams or spiders that they crush. Its really absurd but is incredibly prevalent.
Cows are fed food they are not supposed ot eat (grains as opposed to grasses) so you can have nice cuts of meat. Because of this they live in pain, with heartburn and other problems. they live a difficult life, being readied for the slaughterhouse.
Hunters try to make ethical kills, with one bullet to the vitals. They fade and die very quickly.
Funny thing is that anti-hunters think that they love and understand these animals more than hunters can. This is not true. Since I began hunting I have a much deeper understanding, respect and love for these animals, even as I put them in my crosshairs. Non-hunters can never really gain a respect for a deer, for example, without seeing its attitude, getting skunked, or just watching it in its natural envioronment. I also understanding that without hunters, these cute fuzzy animals would be diseased, starved and damaging many cars on highways.
Coyotes have few, if any natural predators, because humans have destroyed them. Coyotes, if left unchecked can and will decimate small game populations like turkey, grouse a and members of the weasle family (such beautiful creatures as ermine Marten, and mink) not to mention your cute litte cat. Coyotes have to be controlled by hunters. It really is a great arrangement and "animal lovers" are truly a danger to many species.
And Shadowcat, Do you own a cat? Do you let it out doors? If so, does he bring you little treats, like a chipmunk without a head, and a family of baby rabbits? Your cute cat is a ruthless killer who kills for entertainment and your approval, and you just let it roam at will. But maybe rodents don't deserve the protection that coyotes do. And don't try to tell me that cats killing rodents is natural; your cat is domesticated and could not survive in the long tem outside of your home.
In NY you can hunt Coyote day or night, using light and bait FOR A GOOD REASON.
IcantwaittillIhaveafewpeltsforacoat
Mike
.. Man has been hunting animals forever, and always will. It is as it should be and there is nothing wrong with that.. whether you believe God crated us or if you believe evolution made us the way we are; the fact of the matter is that we are all food for each other. That is a matter of fact. WIld game is, to some, the, most delicious meat, or the finest furs (do you have leather shoes or a handbag). Should these people give up these things that they like because you think that animals should only be killed an a slaughterhouse?
Shadowcat says "We don't HAVE to hunt and kill to feed and cloth our familys". so am I supposed to feel fortunate that I can buy clothes made from Saudi Oil, that goes to china, so a child can make my clothes instead of going to school? And, Because this is an option, am I now an outlaw for filling my own freezer?
Some people think that they are better people because they do not see these animals killed. That is absurd. People who have a warm squishy feeling for mammals tend not to grant the good feeling to fish in the streams or spiders that they crush. Its really absurd but is incredibly prevalent.
Cows are fed food they are not supposed ot eat (grains as opposed to grasses) so you can have nice cuts of meat. Because of this they live in pain, with heartburn and other problems. they live a difficult life, being readied for the slaughterhouse.
Hunters try to make ethical kills, with one bullet to the vitals. They fade and die very quickly.
Funny thing is that anti-hunters think that they love and understand these animals more than hunters can. This is not true. Since I began hunting I have a much deeper understanding, respect and love for these animals, even as I put them in my crosshairs. Non-hunters can never really gain a respect for a deer, for example, without seeing its attitude, getting skunked, or just watching it in its natural envioronment. I also understanding that without hunters, these cute fuzzy animals would be diseased, starved and damaging many cars on highways.
Coyotes have few, if any natural predators, because humans have destroyed them. Coyotes, if left unchecked can and will decimate small game populations like turkey, grouse a and members of the weasle family (such beautiful creatures as ermine Marten, and mink) not to mention your cute litte cat. Coyotes have to be controlled by hunters. It really is a great arrangement and "animal lovers" are truly a danger to many species.
And Shadowcat, Do you own a cat? Do you let it out doors? If so, does he bring you little treats, like a chipmunk without a head, and a family of baby rabbits? Your cute cat is a ruthless killer who kills for entertainment and your approval, and you just let it roam at will. But maybe rodents don't deserve the protection that coyotes do. And don't try to tell me that cats killing rodents is natural; your cat is domesticated and could not survive in the long tem outside of your home.
In NY you can hunt Coyote day or night, using light and bait FOR A GOOD REASON.
IcantwaittillIhaveafewpeltsforacoat
Mike
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adkleaddog
New member
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Ripple beat me to it....
Well put.
Now I have to stop the bleeding from biting my tongue!
Well put.
Now I have to stop the bleeding from biting my tongue!
shadowcat
New member
ouch!
Bob: I will apologize for calling you a dufus. I didn’t think it would get you that upset. And, as I added to my thread if you had read the books I have on how meat gets to your plate you’d understand why I called it mass-production. I am not some psycho animal rights activist & I’m certainly not of any grand “stature” – I’m just a person like everyone else trying to get by and making the most of the life I have. Until I started reading about the entire realm of the meat/poultry industry I was totally unaware of how disgusting it is. My comment on “mass produced meat” stands. If you don’t believe me, the next time you are at a library just pick up a book about it. Start with “Slaughterhouse” by Gail Eisnite.
Rondak46: Yes, I do have cats. 9 of them. All of which I rescued from outdoors. NONE of them roam outside – ever. I am totally aware of the situation you spoke of and would never do anything to make it worse. Also, although I don’t think I could ever kill anything and even though I hate sport hunting I do understand those who do it solely as a means to feed their family. But lets be honest there really aren’t that many out there that fit that profile, most is sport hunting and I can not support killing for pleasure. That’s just my opinion and I come from Upper Michigan and most of my brothers and father, grandfather – heck even mother used to hunt!
Barry Sr: You got me started with your comment about blondes and furs. That was just the wrong thing for me to see. But even though I went off on you, you have been the only one who hasn’t attacked me for my opinions and I appreciate you defending me on more than one occasion. You seem too nice a guy to hunt!
Overall, I have to say I am really surprised at the amount of people who take the opposite view then I do. I guess I just thought because we all share a love of the outdoors that more would be against hunting but boy was I wrong! It’s a good thing I have a strong backbone! But I started it and I’m the first one to say you never know where these things will lead and that’s what makes them interesting and informative.
Bob: I will apologize for calling you a dufus. I didn’t think it would get you that upset. And, as I added to my thread if you had read the books I have on how meat gets to your plate you’d understand why I called it mass-production. I am not some psycho animal rights activist & I’m certainly not of any grand “stature” – I’m just a person like everyone else trying to get by and making the most of the life I have. Until I started reading about the entire realm of the meat/poultry industry I was totally unaware of how disgusting it is. My comment on “mass produced meat” stands. If you don’t believe me, the next time you are at a library just pick up a book about it. Start with “Slaughterhouse” by Gail Eisnite.
Rondak46: Yes, I do have cats. 9 of them. All of which I rescued from outdoors. NONE of them roam outside – ever. I am totally aware of the situation you spoke of and would never do anything to make it worse. Also, although I don’t think I could ever kill anything and even though I hate sport hunting I do understand those who do it solely as a means to feed their family. But lets be honest there really aren’t that many out there that fit that profile, most is sport hunting and I can not support killing for pleasure. That’s just my opinion and I come from Upper Michigan and most of my brothers and father, grandfather – heck even mother used to hunt!
Barry Sr: You got me started with your comment about blondes and furs. That was just the wrong thing for me to see. But even though I went off on you, you have been the only one who hasn’t attacked me for my opinions and I appreciate you defending me on more than one occasion. You seem too nice a guy to hunt!
Overall, I have to say I am really surprised at the amount of people who take the opposite view then I do. I guess I just thought because we all share a love of the outdoors that more would be against hunting but boy was I wrong! It’s a good thing I have a strong backbone! But I started it and I’m the first one to say you never know where these things will lead and that’s what makes them interesting and informative.
shadowcat
New member
vegan
i did become a vegetarian several yrs ago -- for many reasons. i think the final thing that made me stop eating meat was just all the crap going on in the industry and how unhealthy it had become. i also stopped eating it due to health reasons because of long-term illness and my body now has trouble digesting heavy foods like meat. as far as wearing leather goes, as i stated i try very hard to stand by my beliefs and choices. however i do have items of leather. i have shoes that go back 10 years and they are leather. i have hiking boots a few yrs old that are leather. however, i try to choose items that support what i believe. i have an awesome pair of "pleather" pants and no one knows they aren't real. i admitted i am not perfect but i try not to be a hypocrit either. i don't wear fur. i had a beautiful fox coat that was given to me years ago. i never felt comfortable wearing it and stopped. it hung in my closet for years until i gave it away to an animal rehab center that cut it up and used with baby wildlife rescues. now would you all like to tell me everything about yourselves?
i did become a vegetarian several yrs ago -- for many reasons. i think the final thing that made me stop eating meat was just all the crap going on in the industry and how unhealthy it had become. i also stopped eating it due to health reasons because of long-term illness and my body now has trouble digesting heavy foods like meat. as far as wearing leather goes, as i stated i try very hard to stand by my beliefs and choices. however i do have items of leather. i have shoes that go back 10 years and they are leather. i have hiking boots a few yrs old that are leather. however, i try to choose items that support what i believe. i have an awesome pair of "pleather" pants and no one knows they aren't real. i admitted i am not perfect but i try not to be a hypocrit either. i don't wear fur. i had a beautiful fox coat that was given to me years ago. i never felt comfortable wearing it and stopped. it hung in my closet for years until i gave it away to an animal rehab center that cut it up and used with baby wildlife rescues. now would you all like to tell me everything about yourselves?
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