likelihood of taking Washington from Gray Knob?

[ruckerz]

That time of the year is upon us.. or me, most likely, and I'm planning my annual winter backpacking trip.

What's the likelihood of taking Gulfside from Adams to Washington at the end of December? Brutal winds? low visibility?

Would the conditions be similar to say the portion of Gulfside from Madison hut to Adams?

Would conditions at Edmands Col be a reasonable summary of the conditions for the rest of the trip? (i.e. a good turning back point)

 

[sierra]

Washington

Wow thats a loaded question if I ever saw one. Predicting the weather above treeline is really difficult at best. I believe though, that the route from Adams to Washington certainally stands to be harder then from Madison to Adams due to the terrain and exposure which I belive is more significant.
You must also take into account that if your camping at Grey knob that you need a fairly signifigent weather window to safely make the return trip and if your overnight gear is stashed at the camp, you leave little option then to return. Although carrieing all your overnight gear would make for a slower time it would give you more options for descending or bailing out if you had too. Personally, I wouldnt use grey knob as a base for Washington, but thats just me, not trying to ruin your itiniary.
I think its a good base for Adams, Jefferson and Madison but IMO Washington is to far for a prudent round trip in the winter, unless you get stellar weather all day, which is what it would proboly take you safely. Now if you carry all your gear and descend say Lions head, I think its a very doable trip as you have your equipment with you and that trip is very doable, sorry I cant remeber if you meant to return to Grey knob but thats mu humble opinion anyway.
P.S. Assessing the conditions at Edmonds col might help on the way to Washingtons summitt, but things can get ugly up there quick and you couldnt imo count on that weather to hold for the return trip if thats what you intended. You could expect anything from high winds, extreme wind chills, low visabiltiy, blowing snow, or very good conditions you must be prepared for all of the above. Be safe and remember turning back while hard, sometimes takes more guts then continueing on.

 

[jfb]

I'd say that for an experienced winter hiker who's prepared for the potential conditions, it would be a great idea. Hiking up to Grey Knob is pretty simple and it's a good place to stay. From there, I'd take all my gear and continue up to Thunderstorm Junction where you could get a good idea of the conditions. Temps. could be well below zero, winds well over 100 mph and visibility could be 10 ft. or less. On a day like that, I'd go back to Grey Knob. On the other hand, I've also seen sunny skies with temps. in the 20s and no wind.

I've hiked up the Airline in late December with temps in the single digits and light winds and arrived at the summit and got blasted by winds from the southwest, so I wouldn't say that the section from Madison Hut to Adams is always a good indication of what the rest of the trail is like because it depends on which way the wind's blowing.

Assuming you can continue along the Gulfside to Edmands Col, if conditions deteriorate, it's an easy hike down the Randolph Path back to treeline and you could return to Grey Knob or go back down Lowe's Path. IN late December, snow depths should not be too great and snowshoes probably would not be necessary. Of course, it could also snow 3 feet the day you're up there. After summitting Jefferson, the next good bailout route would be the Jewell trail, there's a clearing just below treeline (trees about 10 ft. tall, approx. 4000 ft. elevation). At the bottom of the Jewell trail, you could follow roads to get back to Lowe's Store.

If you make it up over Washington, the Lion's Head trail would be a good way down. You could then stay at Hermit Lake or the Harvard Cabin that night.

 

[ruckerz]

Gracias sirs


I was thinking of round tripping it from grey knob .. saving weight and making better time. but it sounds like it's better to take everything ... in case we have to bail and camp in the brush somewhere in one of the valleys. I didn't want to use two cars for this trip, but it sounds like it's going to happen.

thanks!

p.s. how's the cairn situation on gulfside? GPS/compass necessary?

 

[jfb]

I don't remember much about cairns on the Gulfside. There probably are plenty, but they are not as memorable as the ones on Tuckerman's Ravine trail or the Davis Path. Definitely bring a compass or GPS, but for the most part you just need to follow along the top of the ridge. It would not be a good idea to try the route for the first time if visibility is poor.

 

[Panama Jack]

Wow!

I am so impressed reading all of your posts in this thread so far. The question as well as the answers all demonstrated excellent approaches to a difficult scenario.

Most impressed with the recollection of the wind direction! Wow!

 

[David Metsky]

You could also consider starting from the Perch, which will save you a considerable amount of time.

Some things to keep in mind:

• Edmands Col can be a trap. The winds are often at your back when entering, pushing you along. When you decide to turn around it may be nearly impossible to make progress.
• Know your escape routes! Heading down Jewel to the Cog base is typically your best option. Avoid heading down into the Great Gulf at all costs. The Ammy isn't bad but much rougher than Jewel with all the ice up high.
• GPS is good. A compass and the knowledge of how to use it is required. Batteries die, electronics fail.
• The only place along this route that offers some protecting is near Sphinx Col. Not a great place to bivy in bad weather but if it's your only option...

Of course, it might turn out to be a bluebird day, and you'll be skipping along the ridge. But it's best to prepare for the worst.

-dave-

 

[Jim lombard]

I was on the Gulfside in July and there are plenty of cairns but in winter it can be a different story, they're usually covered in rime or snow and with bad visibility they blend right in with the terrain.......you would need to rely on compass and map. I had a "bluebird" day as Dave says back in 2001 when I climbed Adams from Rt2 (Lowes) and felt if we'd stayed at one of the shelters we could've gone to Washington and back.

But the next day was March 5th when the March Lion storm hit and dumped about 20 inches of snow with wild winds and no visibility.......I would bet that even an experienced mountaineer wouldn't have attempted it that day.

 

[dave.m]

I'm a weenie and a dad with a fairly low threshold for risk. That said, an Adams to Washington run is as exposed as you can possibly get in the Whites. I would put a winter presidential traverse way up at the top of the list of winter accomplishments in terms of risk involved.

I would not attempt it without planning every possible escape route off the ridge. Study Chauvin's excellent site on the traverse here:
http://www.chauvinguides.com/PresiTraverse/presiguide.htm

Pay particular attention to Chauvin's escape routes and the compass bearings. If I were attempting that run, I would print this off on small paper, laminate it and attach it and a compass to an outside ziper pocket on my coat via a cord. Be sure you understand the compass bearings so you don't get confused by declaination issues.

End of December is the shortest possible day light of the year. I would concur with Dave Metsky's advice to consider leaving from Perch (colder but shorter). I would add to that a suggestion to consider leaving well in the pre-dawn. I would want to be leaving Edmunds Col and skirting Jefferson at first light if the plan was to get back to Perch by dark. Perhaps a turn around time of 10:30 or 11:00.

Can't emphasize enough Dave's warning that the predominant NW winds can sucker punch you on your return north along the ridge. Reduced visibility, impossibly fogging goggles (even on clear windy days), increased cold, facial frostbite and slower travel speeds should all be expected hiking into the wind as you return. This is to say, as a rule, I would expect the northbound leg to be harder based on normal wind patterns.

A winter presi traverse is quite an undertaking. I've never screwed up the courage for it myself.

 

[Tramper Al]

There is a lot of good advice here.

Don't let Washington 'take' you.

 

[sierra]

compass

I say this in the with the most kind intentions, you should never ask if a compass or GPS is nessesary. While I do not use a gps, my compass never leaves my pack and I always carry the appropiate map for the ground Im hiking as well. I would as I do, sit down some night before your trip, lay out your map and practice reading bearings from various places along your intended route. Carrieing a compass and map is great, but have you ever tried to read one and figure out where to go during a storm? Its not easy at all. Even knowing a broad direction to a bail out route is better then nothing, the key to a route like the Presidentials is in the event of bad weather go down off the ridge, to many people try to continue the traverse in adverse conditions, below treeline, even if far from your car is a whole lot more suvivable then being above treeline where wind chills can kill quickly.

 

[RoySwkr]

I don't remember much about cairns on the Gulfside. There probably are plenty, but they are not as memorable as the ones on Tuckerman's Ravine trail or the Davis Path. Definitely bring a compass or GPS, but for the most part you just need to follow along the top of the ridge.

This is particularly bad advice. Almost none of the Gulfside is on top of the ridge, even if you follow all the summit spurs it is probably only half. Look at a quad if you don't believe me. A compass or GPS will allow you to bushwhack in the right direction but probably aren't enough to stay on the trail. For following a sidehill trail you have to rely on the cairns, which are topped with yellow rocks but aren't as numerous as they were before the rock walls were put in.

 

[giggy]

I am making a couple of assumptions by the questions you asked. You already know the deal for potential hell up there and I assume your in decent hiking shape. You come across that way anyway if your even considering this. I haven't looked at the book but I would guess this would be 10 plus miles to and back miles in the cold wind.

Personally - I think on a good day this is totally doable with an early start. Now - you may have to hang out a grey knob for a week to get that day. I don't know how comfortable you are about climbing up there in total whiteout choas - but is it dobable - sure it is. Is it risky on a shite day - yes sure it is. On a good day - would be really fun - yep. I am not going to mention the compass, etc... you already know that. I think it would be a bit wordse on washington than masidon. It could be the best day or worse day.