Osceola - road to summit??

[AHIKER]

On Friday I hiked Osceola and E. Peak. It was in the 20's and a lot of ice on the upper part of the trail. I had no cramp ons so had to take it easy!
I am about 68 yrs old and last climed these peaks on 9/15/1968. I was expecting a road near the top as back then the fire tower was still up and I remember following a road. What happened to the road?? I can understand the removal of the tower but how do you get rid of a road?? I am revisiting some of my earlier 4000 footer climbs. On Tuesday I'm expecting to do Pierce(Clinton) and Jackson. The temp should be good at high 50's but there are showers expected. If anyone wants to join me I'll be at the trail head (Davis Path) about 8am. I don't really like to hike along at this time of year mainly because of my age and the weather conditions. It took me took me an hour and 55 minutes to get to the summit of Osceola (3.2 m) if that gives you any idea of my "speed" or lack thereof. Happy Trails.

Gordon "Rennaisance Man" Ripley
Rindge, NH

 

[NH_Mtn_Hiker]

I wasn't hiking the Whites back in '68, but there use to be a trail/road that started up from the West Branch about 1.75 miles east of where the Mt. Osceola Trail begins now. (Tripoli Rd.) Why it was relotated I have no idea.

Historic map, see top right corner

 

[dug]

On Friday I hiked Osceola and E. Peak. It was in the 20's and a lot of ice on the upper part of the trail. I had no cramp ons so had to take it easy!
I am about 68 yrs old and last climed these peaks on 9/15/1968. I was expecting a road near the top as back then the fire tower was still up and I remember following a road. What happened to the road?? I can understand the removal of the tower but how do you get rid of a road?? I am revisiting some of my earlier 4000 footer climbs. On Tuesday I'm expecting to do Pierce(Clinton) and Jackson. The temp should be good at high 50's but there are showers expected. If anyone wants to join me I'll be at the trail head (Davis Path) about 8am. I don't really like to hike along at this time of year mainly because of my age and the weather conditions. It took me took me an hour and 55 minutes to get to the summit of Osceola (3.2 m) if that gives you any idea of my "speed" or lack thereof. Happy Trails.

Gordon "Rennaisance Man" Ripley
Rindge, NH

Hoo-boy, where to begin.

First, your speed is fine. Actually, a pretty good clip for this part of the year.

Second, many peaks have changed considerably over the years. Lots have had roads to them, and are now just trails. There are some subtle hints along the way, and if you know what to loo for and if a trail used to be a railroad or cart path, you can tell quite easily.

So, the road isn't really gone...it's just grown over and it now just a trail. 40 years is a lifetime in tree-years. I first hit the peaks only a couple of years after you left, and I can tell first hand some major differences in some trails. However, some look virtually the same!

 

[HAMTERO]

I feel a "find the road" bushwack coming on!

 

[Papa Bear]

From my 1966 WMG:

Osceola Trail ... turns north and climbs by long switchbacks to the ridge (views S and SW), ... at about 3.3 miles makes a sharp R and follows the route of the old trelephone line to the summit. ...

Here's the 1966 map:

(click for full size image)

From my WMG 27th edition (2003):

Osceola Trail ...The trails resumes its switchbacks, gains the summit ridge and turns right, and soon reaches the summit ledge at 3.2 mi., with excellent views. ...

So the old telephone line is no longer mentioned. I'm guessing that was your "road".

Here's the 2003 map (more wiggles, but basically the same trail):

(click for full size image)

So it looks like there was an old right of way along the ridge for the telephone line to the tower which is now just "absorbed" into the trail. Anyone remember seeing any old wire lying on the ground in this section:

Sorry guys, no bushwhack.

 

[carole]

So it looks like there was an old right of way along the ridge for the telephone line to the tower which is now just "absorbed" into the trail. Anyone remember seeing any old wire lying on the ground in this section:

Sorry guys, no bushwhack.

Actually, at this turn toward the summit you will also find the old route heading for a bit toward Middle Osceola. It is grown in but quite obvious and the wire is there still. Bushwhack indeed!

 

[HAMTERO]

The trail on NH_Mtn_Hiker's map is to the east of the present trail. There was also a trail up Osceola Brook.

 

[Double Bow]

So it looks like there was an old right of way along the ridge for the telephone line to the tower which is now just "absorbed" into the trail. Anyone remember seeing any old wire lying on the ground in this section

Last year, I figured out what contour and bearing one would turn off the trail and head toward Middle and West Osceola with. Then, when I reached that contour, I found what looked like a herd path heading off at that bearing.

On 10/21 of this year, as I was heading out to Middle Osceola, I followed that "herd path" and was following old wire. In fact, tripped over it and nearly fell on my face!

The "herd path"/trail hybrid is pretty well defined, though it gets to a point where there are quite a few blowdowns and the spruce gets thicker. I only went to Middle Osceola (instead of West) as I had friends waiting for me who weren't up for a snowy, wet "whack", though I intend to go back next year, when the ground is uncovered. Thank you Trailwrights.

There are some interesting things in there...

 

[Raymond]

That's where those two boys from Acton and Boxborough spent an unexpected night out a few years ago.

 

[sapblatt]

Lack of speed????
That was fast - 40 minutes + ahead of book time.
I did that speed in August on Osceola - but a week ago on snow and ice was an hour slower...
You have not lost any speed - I did not know about the road.

 

[RoySwkr]

Hi Gordon,

I'll bet that the current trail was cleared wider and less eroded back then so it seemed like a road, I had the impression it was once a bridle path but can't confirm that

I followed the wire up from the East Pond Trail on an AMC hike with Gene Daniell maybe 20 years ago, this was not ever a road

I also tried to follow the Osceola Brook route a few years ago, no luck

 

[askus3]

I descended Osceola on June 15, 1971 down to Tripoli Road in Thornton Gap. I vaguely remember descending a wood fire road from the fire tower, so I was expecting an old fire road for descent and I told my group that when I was planning the hike, that the downhill would be pleasant and easygoing. So a couple of the hike participants wanted to know where the road was that they were supposed to be descending when they went down a long downhill trek along a trail. This was after climbing over East Peak from Greeley Ponds. I just responded my mind must be playing tricks with me as it was now August 6, 2004 (33 years later). Maybe this thread says I am not losing it (and I don't mean the trail). I wish I had pictures of the fire road, but all I have are photos of views from the fire tower and my climb up East Peak. I also remember when the trail up East Peak went straight up from Upper Greeley Pond, but now it starts further to the north, although it is still relentless. I still see the merge on the hillside of the original route (a little below the old slide viewpoint) which is now blocked with some wood and made to look obscure. Here is the first of 50 photos from my 8/6/04 hike up East Peak & Osceola with a few of my 1971 photos tossed in for camparison.

 

[HAMTERO]

Great Contrast

I really liked the 1971 photos. You looked a lot younger then!

 

[MichaelJ]

The old topo maps (1930's vintage) show what appears to be that telephone line trail heading all the way down to Tripoli Road, even passing a few buildings (little black squares) which are labelled as the "Tripoli Mill".

Roy - is this route what you mean by Osceola Brook?

I've always wanted to try to come down that way, follow whatever remains, look for cellar holes, etc.

 

[Undershaft]

I climbed Osceola and East Osceola this past August. I spent a liitle time bushwhacking around the summit of Osceola and found some old wires up there. I was a bit puzzled by it at the time, but it now makes sense.

 

[askus3]

Hamtero,

Yes, I aged a little but can still get up into those mountains. Actually, I was 19 in 1971, thus 52 in 2004! I can still do the math.

 

[RoySwkr]

The old topo maps (1930's vintage) show what appears to be that telephone line trail heading all the way down to Tripoli Road, even passing a few buildings (little black squares) which are labelled as the "Tripoli Mill".

Roy - is this route what you mean by Osceola Brook?

No, that's the route I did with Gene Daniell, we were able to follow the wire as much as we wanted back then

Osceola Brook is on the other side
http://www.topozone.com/map.asp?lat=43.9913&lon=-71.52119&size=l&u=4&datum=nad27&layer=DRG
There is a long note in this file somewhere about the 2 trails that used to come up that way, which I didn't find

 

[dms]

Ravine Trail

Roy, it was the Ravine Path that followed the brook. It descended the ridge at the Osceola/E. Osceola col. It also led to the Split Cliff, another great spot along the ridge. I have also tried to find traces of it without any success.
BTW, the 1934 AMC White Mountain Guide calls the trail that follows the old telephone lines a "road", at that time it was known as the Bread Tray Trail.

 

[Jazzbo]

A second clue bearing out NH MT Hiker's map

Here's a link to 1963? map posted on lost trails web site showing the trail going down that particular shoulder of Osceola shown on NH MT Hiker's Historic Map.

http://www.whitemountainlosttrails.com/Maps/OsceolaBrook1936.jpg

My 1955 AMC guide narrative indicates there was ruins of a ranger cabin 1/2 mile below summit with a good spring. I'm guessing the cabin and tower would have been served by the power line and provided vehicle or wagon/bridel path access to the summit tower. I think bushwack is not unreasonable. With Tripoli Road closed in winter, such a route would offer better access to summit in winter or summer.

It would be worth researching old AMC Guides or Appalachia proceedings to see when and why it was decided to re-route the trail. It would appear the old trail offers many advantages over current trail.

 

[Papa Bear]

The old topo maps (1930's vintage) show what appears to be that telephone line trail heading all the way down to Tripoli Road, even passing a few buildings (little black squares) which are labelled as the "Tripoli Mill".

MichaelJ

Here's a composite from the 1931/32 15 minute USGS Franconia and Plymouth quads (which NH_Mtn_Hiker first posted a link to):

Note that this is pre-Kank, pre-Tripoli Rd. I don't see what you are referring to. There are the trails from the west and south which have been mentioned but I see no indication of phone lines. There is of course the town boundary line along the ridge.

What maps are you looking at? Can you post them?