Flowed Land rescue this past weekend

[Chip]

. As he travelled Flowed Land, bad visibility lead him down Hanging Spears trail instead of the Calnmity Trail. Later the other climber having reached his second summit headed back to Upper Works. Upon reaching parking he noticed that his friends car was still there and notified the rangers.

I guess the assumption is that he would not have missed the turn if he was not solo ? In this case, the fact that his partner got back and saw his car and reported meant 1 person spent the afternoon/early evening in the woods as opposed to possibly 2 spending the night.

I missed a turn in the Catskills once as it was getting dark on an unfamiliar trail, kind of a funny story afterwards. I wound up back at my truck at the trailhead, but I came close to dropping pack and setting up for the night. These things happen.

 

[Papa Bear]

All jokes and Monday Morning quarterbacking aside, we can all be VERY glad this one did not end like the one on Little Haystack.

It's great when after a screw-up like this you can joke about it, debate the issues and learn some good lessons.

Not so great when the ending was not so good.

 

[mavs00]

Post Script

ADKdremn was kind enough to add a detailed account over at. ADKHP.

If you haven't already made up your mind about the situation, it might be worth the nice long read. If not for the lessons it teaches us about ourselves and the ordeal. Thanks Andy.

Right on PB, peace and condolences to the family of the lost hiker, and prayers and healing thoughts to the surviving party that he will improve.

 

[Little Rickie]

ADKdream made a mistake (it happens) and was prepared for it. I'm glad he was. He did good. From my readings he doesn't seem to be a risk taker or defiant of nature. Stuff happens. Give him a break.

We all chose freely to participate in Saturdays gathering. The safety and leadership issues were part of our discussions on the forum and well emphasized.

BlackSpruce your statment:

"This is the second story of this past weekend event that testifies that in winter unless experienced and very trails knowledgeable one shouldn't travel alone particularly if tired at the end of a long tough day!"

Is as valid as ever and should be heeded.

I'm sure a lesson has been learned.


Peace

 

[Rik]

Tom, for sure, count me as part of the "old school" team!

It has happened several times that a member of our climbing group needed to turned back, and every time no matter how badly I wanted to reach the summit I decided that I would be a stronger person for turning back as well. I just couldn't do otherwise. Still on many ways it was on each occasion a very easy decision for me, as the furthest trail head is 40 minutes from my house, plus I know that I am as lucky as can be to be physically able to climb any peak again without much hardship.

Didn't someone turn back when we all took that long walk to Donaldson from the winter lot a few years back?
I'm pretty sure I remember most of the group continuing?

 

[BlackSpruce]

Rik,

Yes one person of our group turned back but first it was long before any climbing, still early in the morning and at least another individual from another group did the same at the same time, furthermore there were no solitude on that road that particular day and morning (plus not really the posibility of getting lost).

We had to park at the winter trailhead before the bridge and quite few of the 30 or so climbers moving into the Sewards that day were here and about and ended up turning around as any given summit was requiring a 20+ miles of walking. Actually I remember just about every details about that "only Donaldson" climb in very deep snow at the beginning of the winter season.

Christine

 

[PackMule]

Anyone who has spent any time in the mountains has had this sort of thing happen. Good for you getting through unharmed and having the smarts to carry all the needed gear for a night out in the woods in the winter.

You are right no one is to blame. It was just an error in judgemet as you said.
Glad to hear you are OK, hope you take something from the ordeal that you can use for the rest of you hiking days.

 

[Rik]

Rik,

Yes one person of our group turned back but first it was long before any climbing, still early in the morning and at least another individual from another group did the same at the same time, furthermore there were no solitude on that road that particular day and morning (plus not really the posibility of getting lost).

We had to park at the winter trailhead before the bridge and quite few of the 30 or so climbers moving into the Sewards that day were here and about and ended up turning around as any given summit was requiring a 20+ miles of walking. Actually I remember just about every details about that "only Donaldson" climb in very deep snow at the beginning of the winter season.

Christine

So sometimes it is ok to let someone turn back alone?

 

[BlackSpruce]

Rik,

Early in the morning a few straight miles away from the parking lot on a nice day if you were feeling fine and knew the area well I would let YOU go back alone no problem! ...unless of course you weren't carrying your backpack .

Christine

 

[dug]

Rik,

Early in the morning a few straight miles away from the parking lot on a nice day if you were feeling fine and knew the area well I would let YOU go back alone no problem! ...unless of course you weren't carrying your backpack .

Christine

Hmm, interesting. What is the cutoff, since "straight" and "few" are relative terms?

 

[Rik]

Rik,

Early in the morning a few straight miles away from the parking lot on a nice day if you were feeling fine and knew the area well I would let YOU go back alone no problem! ...unless of course you weren't carrying your backpack .

Christine

So it's a judgement call? Just like Andy and Steve made?


Me, no pack, never.

 

[BlackSpruce]

Hmm, interesting. What is the cutoff, since "straight" and "few" are relative terms?

I would say between 20 feet and 55 miles....

 

[Neil]

All is relative. After bushwhacking to the top of Henderson Mountain after crossing Henderson Lake our party of 4 split into a group of 3 and a solo hiker who re-descended Henderson while the other 3 went and did Santanoni and Panther. That was the plan all along however and the solo dude once hiked all one hundred of the ADK hundred Highest in a single winter.

Like, no sweat in that particular instance.

Then I've been on other hikes (Cascade, Jay, Phelps) where I wasn't letting anyone out of my sight for 30 seconds without getting antsy.

You read the book, fine. Out there on the sharp end is where judgment comes into play and they still haven't figured out how to put judgment into print.


I read somewhere an affirmation that safety and the web needs to be addressed. I saw 60 people climbing Algonquin on Saturday and I wish I had done a poll because of all the people in the hills the vast majority out there don't use the web for hiking. And trust me, over the years I have asked quite a few. In the hills I see all sorts of people that would get torn up on a thread for all the "stupid" stuff they appear to be doing. Preaching safety on VFTT is like a prof. scolding the few students who attended the class that most skipped out on.


You can really pour it on and strike out at anyone on-line. I have even read where people blame the 46ers for the evils of list-fever and ecological damage in the high peaks.

These forums are no more than a place where a small minority of serious hikers come to hang out and BS about hiking, trips, gear, routes and the like. And sure enough there are novice ears listening to the "big guys" shoot the bull about dropping packs, bushwhacking in the dark, going out pretty far on a limb etc. etc.

Anyone trying to make them into something greater, something more serious, should try and start their own forum. Most members give me the impression of coming here for some relief from whatever seriousness they already have to deal with nearly 24/7. I know that is my case.

On ADKHP we created a leadership and saftey sub-forum, only available for viewing by our members, specifically for the Feb 9 event. It was researched out last year and we started it up a couple of weeks ago. I would call it a dud. Hardly anyone posted or even read in it. I think 3 threads were started (2 by me I think) and they got little play. Fact is, very few people seem to be interested in re-hashing these issues on the forums. Not saying its right or wrong. Just the way it looks to me.

 

[BlackSpruce]

Andy, Adam,

You should send the account of your adventure to the Editors of PEEKS, they may be interesd in publishing it.

Christine

PS: "These forums are no more than a place where a small minority of serious hikers come to hang out and BS about hiking, trips, gear, routes and the like." Neil allow me to disagree, it may apply to your own Forum ADKHP but from my experience a very large number of climbers read VFFT but never posts. For confirmation just look at the activity number at the bottom of the forum window. As well personnally on the trails VFFT and other forums have been mentionned countless times by other hikers.

 

[WinterWarlock]

PS: "These forums are no more than a place where a small minority of serious hikers come to hang out and BS about hiking, trips, gear, routes and the like." Neil allow me to disagree, it may apply to your own Forum ADKHP but from my experience a very large number of climbers read VFFT but never posts. For confirmation just look at the activity number at the bottom of the forum window. As well personnally on the trails VFFT and other forums have been mentionned countless times by other hikers.

I didn't read this exactly the same way - I thought Neil was saying, in effect, these are the modern equivalent of hanging out at the old corner bar and shooting the breeze with some like minded folks...some info transferred is valuable, and some is BS, as it ever will be wherever you go.

 

[Neil]

Andy, Adam,

You should send the account of your adventure to the Editors of PEEKS, they may be interesd in publishing it.

Christine

PS: "These forums are no more than a place where a small minority of serious hikers come to hang out and BS about hiking, trips, gear, routes and the like." Neil allow me to disagree, it may apply to your own Forum ADKHP but from my experience a very large number of climbers read VFFT but never posts. For confirmation just look at the activity number at the bottom of the forum window. As well personnally on the trails VFFT and other forums have been mentionned countless times by other hikers.

Most of that activity is just Google bots and spiders sweeping the forums. At least the "guests" one sees.

Lurkers....what? Hang out to listen to what the small minority have to say about compass declination and lost hikers? OK. Maybe they're just goofing off at work. Anyway, I don't seize your point.

 

[BlackSpruce]

For the comments I have often heard on the trails the web is a big source of information, its value can be argued over and over of course. The activity on the Q&A section of the forums testify that very little is BS and the as busy trip reports section shows that most want to share the joy of a great day with friends in the woods.

 

[Neil]

OK, got it. When I say BS I don't mean uselessness. BS'ing can refer to what gear is best in a whiteout on Algonquin just as it can refer to the best posthike brew.

Not suggesting that those who participate here only input pure BS, Gee, that would be self-deprecating in the extreme given my post count.

 

[David Metsky]

Lurkers....what? Hang out to listen to what the small minority have to say about compass declination and lost hikers? OK. Maybe they're just goofing off at work. Anyway, I don't seize your point.

Lots of people read this site without being members. They range from very experienced hikers checking on friends to complete newbies who are looking for any and all information about hiking. There is far more impact to your posts then you might imagine.

 

[Neil]

Lots of people read this site without being members. They range from very experienced hikers checking on friends to complete newbies who are looking for any and all information about hiking. There is far more impact to your posts then you might imagine.

Fair enough. But I contend that free information found on the internet is worth at best what you paid for it. Same as medical advice for a sore knee.

Infotainment would describe a lot of what I read on various forums. But it is absolutely true, one does find excellent advice and beta. However, it requires a previously acquired background of knowledge to differentiate the wheat from the chaff.