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Correct. I did get the 50mm 1.4, but my next lens will be $600+, and I had planned on adding a protecting filter to that as well. Maybe I won't now. :) I just ordered the B+W F-PRO MRC circular polarizer for the 50mm. It'll be awhile before I can afford the 2nd lens so the 50mm will be my mountain lens for now. Thanks for the clarification. You make some valid points.

- Bill
 
BillK said:
Correct. I did get the 50mm 1.4, but my next lens will be $600+, - Bill

whew! I read that other post and thought "oh my god, he got porked". I felt bad for you. OK, I feel better now.

Look at it this way, not buying two $60 filters = $120 towards a third lens. :D

- darren
(standing by to provide picture of lens with smashed front element)
 
DougPaul said:
The only perfect optical system is no optical system.

A filter is another element with imperfections and reflective surfaces. Maybe the added degradation will show, maybe it won't. Depends on the scene, the quality of the lens without the filter, and how carefully you look.

Double-coated filters ($$) are generally better than single-coated filters ($). No filter is even better optically ($0 unless you damage your lens... :) ).

Doug

Thanks Doug. Do you keep a filter on your lenses?

- Bill
 
BillK said:
Thanks Doug. Do you keep a filter on your lenses?
Yes. Haven't made the comparison--maybe I should. (But then I am using Canon's "ordinary" lenses rather than the L series. The issue might only show up on the better lenses.)

I am also careful to shade the lens from direct sunlight--usually with my hand--to reduce the possibility of flare and scatter off dust etc.

A filter on a wide-angle can also increase vignetting.

Doug
 
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I keep a filter on my lenses. I usually opt for a multicoated UV. I don't really see a quantifiable difference to keep it off but that could be due to the subject matter I shoot. I'm sure if I was a studio photographer or photographed subjects under controlled conditions I wouldn't use a filter.
 
Darren, while I certainly understand your aversion to using filters as lens front element protectors, my own experience leads me to disagree with your conclusions.

First of all, I don’t believe high quality filters will appreciably degrade the quality of images produced by high quality lenses. The far greater and more common degrades come from misfocus, and camera movement during exposure, and poor exposure in the first place. I do believe the filter should be used in conjunction with a lens shade to minimize the aggravation of flare problems.

I actually have seen horribly mangled front lens elements – scratched, dinged, gouged, smeared, etc. that I would think should make it impossible to shoot a decent image but that actually produce very good images, under ideal conditions. They do poorly, though, when the conditions are in any way likely to generate flare. A lens with pristine front element but fitted with a dirty, scratched, gouged, etc. filter will perform similarly.

Second of all, I think it is fairly easy to damage a lens front element. I have seen numerous high-end lenses badly compromised by damaged front lens elements that were not protected by filters. I have in mind, especially, 9 separate lenses worth in aggregate about $12,500 (street price) used by colleagues over the last 4-5 years. These lenses have been in daily service under all kinds of ordinary (but no extreme) weather and shooting conditions.

I’ll acknowledge the damage has been due, mainly, to careless handling. But it doesn’t take much to do the damage – a little junk in the bottom of a camera bag has done the worst damage to front elements in almost every case. Optical glass and coatings are relatively soft and easy to mar. The repairs – to replace damaged front lens elements – run considerably higher in cost (and take a lot longer) than replacing a protective filter.

Yes, the damaged lenses are used by professionals, and they are not protected by filters. They are “company” gear, and not personal equipment. Most pro shooters I know who use their own gear do protect investment and livelihood by covering the front elements of their own lenses with filters and protecting them with shades.

Not long ago I watched one colleague heave a huge sigh of relief when he realized the damage done by foul tipped softball that hit the front of his 70-200mm lens was a demolished lens hood and clear filter; the front element of the lens was clean as a whistle.

I do note that some of the lens shades these days provide little physical protection, and do not fasten onto the lens very securely. That can be a problem, in my opinion.

Third, there is a reason most of the “big glass” lenses – the super fast, long FL lenses -- have “sacrificial” front elements. These are designed to be readily replaced at relatively low cost (several hundred bucks, I believe), compared to cost of the lens itself. They are out there, and vulnerable to degrading damage.

Fourth, protecting the rear elements of your lenses is crucial. I have had more trouble with image degrade due to marked or smudged rear lens elements than with front elements.

Now, here’s how my own lenses actually get used, every day.

1) Each lens is equipped with a good quality “clear” filter to protect its front element.

2) Filters are cleaned, as needed. The lens glass is very rarely touched (not necessary).

3) Each lens is fitted with its own shade.

4) Dismounted lenses are carried in a camera gear bag that has padded compartments.

5) I rarely use front lens caps.

6) I do use rear lens caps on dismounted lenses.

7) I do not “stack” filters.

When hiking, dismounted lenses are carried in Neoprene pouches, just as they are carried in the camera gear bag for daily use.

G.
 
Grumpy said:
I’ll acknowledge the damage has been due, mainly, to careless handling. But it doesn’t take much to do the damage – a little junk in the bottom of a camera bag has done the worst damage to front elements in almost every case.

5) I rarely use front lens caps.

Well I guess if people don't use lens caps and stick lenses in bags without them then the debate continues.

- darren
 
darren said:
Well I guess if people don't use lens caps and stick lenses in bags without them then the debate continues.
He (grumpy) does leave the lens hoods on. IMO, a reasonable compromise since he carries the lenses in a gear bag with padded compartments.

Doug
 
darren said:
Well I guess if people don't use lens caps and stick lenses in bags without them then the debate continues.

- darren

Just for the record, I don't use "shop" gear -- the lenses I wrote about above received their insults at the hands of staff colleagues. I supply my own equipment, and every one of my own lenses has its front element protected by a filter and shade. I also use rear lens caps.

I do "stick lenses in bags" without front lens caps, and have done so for decades. I have never damaged a lens by doing that. My bag interiors are kept clean and free of junk.

The reason I use this approach is that in my line of work it is important to have my camera gear at the ready with minimum fuss and bother. Front lens caps are just another item to fumble with, and have proven themselves to be unnecessary. A protective filter works as well, and in my opinion does not noticeably degrade image sharpness. I have filters that do exhibit some flare problems in heavy backlight, especially when they need a good cleaning -- but I can live with that.

Protective filters are an integral part of my way of working. They may not suit everyone, for any number of reasons. But experience tells me they are good insurance at low dollar and other cost.

G.
 
Hazy Memories

Haze is a major obstacle to scenic photography, to be sure. A very good source (although a bit dated) of information on the subject is found in Appendix A of Scudder's White Mountain Viewing Guide; "Forecasting Excellent Visibility", which I highly recommend giving a thorough read. Keeping an eye out for Canadian highs and planning your trips accordingly can make all the difference in the world. July and August are the worst, as the Canadian highs rarely get strong enough to be a factor.

As far as haze filters, I have never used one except at high altitude. When the haze is bad in the Northeast, you might as well stick to close-range subjects - no filter in the world is going to help!
 
Tim Seaver said:
Haze is a major obstacle to scenic photography, to be sure. July and August are the worst, as the Canadian highs rarely get strong enough to be a factor.

....

When the haze is bad in the Northeast, you might as well stick to close-range subjects - no filter in the world is going to help!

First off, the section of the viewing guide you pointed to should be a must read, excellent information written within...

Just want to add that while scenics are VERY hard during the summer months in the whites during the daylight hours, sunrise and sunset shots are often made more colorful by the increased scattering and diffraction through the haze. No you won't get the 100 mile sunsets, but it is a worthwhile effect (Filter or no Filter!)
 
This is from someone just learning about DSLR's, but who's taken thousands of images with 2 Olympus bodies (OM-1 and OM-3) and a series of good lenses.
I always used a rear lens cap. And always kept a filter on the lens. Sometime a UV, sometimes a haze filter, and on nice days, a polarizer. 90% of my images are in the mountains. I like filters not because of the liklihood of damage, but because dew, rain, snow, dust, bugs, smudges happen to the front of the camera. I always felt better about cleaning the polarizing filter on the front of my Zuiko f1.2 instead of the coating on the lens.
This forum, and a variety of friends getting into DSLRs has me waiting to take the plunge myself.
But I'll probably get a good quality filter for my new camera as well.
 
Peakbagr said:
This is from someone just learning about DSLR's, but who's taken thousands of images with 2 Olympus bodies (OM-1 and OM-3) and a series of good lenses.
IMO, the issues of protecting one's lenses are the same for film and digital cameras.

One place where they vary is dust and dirt etc on the sensor or film. Film is fresh for every pic and is pulled out through a felt-like cleaner as it exits the casette. In contrast, dirt on a digital sensor tends to stay there until you explicitly clean the sensor (a delicate operation that many are not brave enough to do). Self-cleaning sensors (such as found in the Canon Digital Rebel XTi) should help.

Doug
 
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