Garmin Mapsource and NG TOPO! on Macs and Linux

[DougPaul]

It may be possible for some of you Mac-a-philes and Linux-lovers to run Garmin Mapsource and National Geographic TOPO! in your chosen computer environments using Wine. Maptech Terrain Navigator may also work.

Wine is an MS Windows emulator which runs on x86-based Unices, (http://www.winehq.org/), including Mac OS X and Linux.

And according to the Wine applications database (http://appdb.winehq.org/, search on MapSource), MapSource now runs in Wine-1.0. This link also provides instructions.

My experience:
* I don't use Macs, so this is my experience using Slackware 12.1 Linux. (I have been running old versions of MapSource on old versions of Wine with partial function for quite a while). This is my experience installing Wine-1.0 and MapSource from scratch. The new installations are working much better than the old ones.

* Wine:
- Compiled Wine-1.0 from source without difficulty. You can probably get precompiled versions for your environment.

* Notes:
- All of the software and maps were installed from disk-resident CDROM images, not the CDROMs, themselves. In some cases, the images must be left on disk for proper operation. In all cases, the software could be used without mounting any CDROMs.
- I installed MapSource, TOPO!, and the Terrain Navigator demos in separate hierarchies (equivalent to using separate machines).
- I haven't tested I/O to a GPS. A poster in the applications database reports success.
- One of the nice things about using emulators is that you can copy a working setup and test on the new one. If you break the new one, you just erase it, make a fresh copy, and try again. (Much easier than reinstalling an OS...)

* Garmin MapSource:
-1. Installed (old) Garmin US Topo (v3.00) . (You install from the first CDROM image and can copy the data for the other regions into the image for full coverage of the country. Or you can probably install each CDROM image individually.) This installs MapSource (v3.02).
-2. Upgraded MapSource to v6.11.5 (http://www.gpsinformation.org/perry/msource/MapSource_6115.exe). The Wine applications database claims that some have succeeded with v6.13.7, but my attempts to upgrade at this point to later versions failed. Step 3 wouldn't work without this upgrade.
-3. Added Metroguide v4.02
-4. Added US Topo 24K East v2.00
-5. Added US tide tables (http://www8.garmin.com/software/RecommendedMapSourceUSTidesSoftware.exe)
-6. Added US Topo 2008 v4.00. (I just quit the install when it asked me to install an Adobe pdf reader.) This seems to have raised the MS version to 6.12.4 (in contrast to my earlier failures to upgrade MS.) My attempts to upgrade to a higher level have failed.
-7. The total size of the directory structure was 6.5 GB, the total size of the CDROMs was 5.7 GB.
-8. MapSource worked pretty well--most tested functions worked pretty well. I could view maps, place waypoints, make routes, read and write files, etc. Couldn't get the tide tables to work.

I also tried from-scratch installs of Metroguide v4.02 (failed), US Topo 24K East (failed), and US Topo 2008 (succeeded). So maybe one could also start with US Topo 2008 and then add other maps.

* National Geographic TOPO! Northeastern USA, v2.7.5 (old version of http://www.natgeomaps.com/topo_newengland)
- install from first the CDROM image and copy data files from other CDROMs into the appropriate directory under c: to install the rest of the data. v2.76 of topo.exe.
- I was able to upgrade to topo.exe v2.77 using http://maps.nationalgeographic.com/downloads/topo277.exe. Info at http://www.natgeomaps.com/downloads.html/
- The total size of the install was 5.8 GB.

* Maptech Terrain Navigator ( http://www.maptech.com/ ):
- I was able to get 2 old demos (ftp://ftp.maptech.com/downloads/ATD.EXE and ftp://ftp.maptech.com/downloads/NHD.EXE) to run, but not a new one (ftp://ftp.maptech.com/downloads/COD.EXE)

----------------------

Happy hacking,

Doug

 

[MichaelJ]

Can the Windows versions under WINE talk over USB to the GPS?

I've had very good luck with Garmin's native "Bobcat" software (still in beta but working very well) on my Mac, and a mixed bag with the NG Topo native version, good enough that I'll thank you for your experiment, but pass, myself.

 

[Maddy]

http://www.winehq.org/), http://appdb.winehq.org/
Cannot open either one of these on my MAC OSX using Firefox which is my normal web browser.

 

[DougPaul]

http://www.winehq.org/), http://appdb.winehq.org/
Cannot open either one of these on my MAC OSX using Firefox which is my normal web browser.

They seem to be down right now--they were up yesterday.

Both map to the same IP address, so they must be the same machine. It answers a ping, but not a connect on port 80 so the web server must be down.

I presume they will be available soon.

Doug

 

[DougPaul]

http://www.winehq.org/ and http://appdb.winehq.org/ are back up now.

Doug

 

[Maddy]

Thanks Doug. I was just able to open it and will need to spend some time checking it out.

 

[DougPaul]

Mad some more progress today...

* The tide tables work--I just had to learn how to access them.

* After step 6 (in post #1), I was able to upgrade to Mapsource v6.13.7.
- install "winetricks corefonts" http://wiki.winehq.org/winetricks
- then install Mapsource v6.13.7 (the latest v.13.x), http://www8.garmin.com/software/MapSource_6137.exe. (Changelogs are available on the Garmin website ( http://www.garmin.com ). Just look for the upgrades in the product info. You can also get the software update from there too.)

* I explored Mapsource v6.14.1, but was unable to install it. The wine apps database reports that others were able to install it, but it didn't run. The reports from rec.backcountry are that a number of early adopters have found problems and have reverted back to 6.13.7. I don't think I'm going to waste any more time on v6.14.1...

Doug

 

[DougPaul]

Can the Windows versions under WINE talk over USB to the GPS?

I've had very good luck with Garmin's native "Bobcat" software (still in beta but working very well) on my Mac, and a mixed bag with the NG Topo native version, good enough that I'll thank you for your experiment, but pass, myself.

There are reports of successful USB communication with the GPS on the Wine website. Certainly using Linux, not sure about Macs. But some of the comments look optimistic. Check http://wiki.winehq.org/ and http://wiki.winehq.org/MacOSX.

My experience with NG TOPO! has been that it was very easy to install and run. Much easier than Mapsource. It has been very handy to have the maps available when reading trip reports, planning trips, etc.

I run Linux as my main environment here--I only boot Windows as a last resort to load maps into the GPS (a very infrequent need). I can (and do) transfer waypoints, routes, and tracks between directly Linux and the GPS using GPSBabel. I'll probably check out communication directly between the GPS and TOPO!/Mapsource under Wine some day, but it is not a priority for me.

To print maps from TOPO!, I just export a map segment to a GIF file, convert to PS, and print.

I find that most of my use of use of TOPO! and Mapsource is looking at the maps, measuring distances, etc. While communication with the GPS would be nice, IMO the installation under Wine has been worth the effort whether they can communicate directly with the GPS or not.

Doug

 

[michaelb]

I am confused because NG Topo runs natively in Os X, and has for years. So I use it regularly. Why would I run the windows version in emulation instead?

I also thought that garmin released a version of its mapping software for Os X as well, at least in beta form. I don't have the maps and don't have a mapping GPS, so I haven't really followed that though.

 

[MichaelJ]

I also thought that garmin released a version of its mapping software for Os X as well, at least in beta form. I don't have the maps and don't have a mapping GPS, so I haven't really followed that though.

Garmin Bobcat

 

[DougPaul]

I am confused because NG Topo runs natively in Os X, and has for years. So I use it regularly. Why would I run the windows version in emulation instead?

What is there to be confused about? If you can run it natively, then you don't need an emulator.

I set up the emulators so I could run NG TOPO! and Garmin Mapsource in Linux, not Mac OS. I personally have no interest in Macs and don't pay much attention to what does or doesn't run on them. Mac OS-X is actually a Unix (one of the BSDs) with Mac layer on top. Since the Wine emulator also runs on Macs, my results are potentially of interest to Mac users. A possible side benefit might be that my info might tempt some Linux and/or Mac users to try the emulator to run some Windows software for which there is no native version.

<preemptive suggestion>
Lets not waste time by going off on a tangent of "my OS is better than yours". The above is just my personal preference.
</preemptive suggestion>

Doug

 

[michaelb]

No problem, it is nice to see that it is working for you in linux.