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Thread: Tecumseh skin up, ski down?

  1. #1
    Senior Member mirabela's Avatar
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    Tecumseh skin up, ski down?

    Anybody know if the ski area has a problem with this? Here in VT, some resorts (Magic Mtn, MRG, etc.) tacitly encourage it any time, others are OK only if it's outside lift op hours, and some (Bolton) don't want it at all.

    Anyone know where Waterville Valley stands on the issue?

    Thanks in advance --

    Matt

  2. #2
    Senior Member audrey's Avatar
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    I've seen people snowshoeing up the Tecumseh slopes a number of times (ditto for Wildcat and Sugarloaf), so I think that skinning would be OK too.
    Bolton must have changed its policies, because years ago when I was learning to tele, I'd go up and down Turnpike all day long.

  3. #3
    Senior Member kaseri's Avatar
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    Not sure about skinning up but we glissaded down today. What fun!

  4. #4
    Senior Member Chip's Avatar
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    Do you mean to skin up the trail for Tecumseh and then ski down the resort trails ? I'm sure you'd get away with that one run down. If you mean to skin up and ski down the resort trails all day long, I'd understand if they had a problem with that. Hard tellin', not knowin'. I think they'd answer honestly if you called them.
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  5. #5
    Senior Member mirabela's Avatar
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    I'm talking about skinning up the resort trails once, then skiing down. I've never climbed Tecumseh, and since I'm all hopped up about playing on skis anyway, it seems like an obvious two-fer to me.

  6. #6
    Senior Member audrey's Avatar
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    You probably know that you still have three quarters of a mile to get to the summit from the top of the ski area, right? That section is not skiable, at least by us mere mortals.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Chip's Avatar
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    I'd call them. It might be considered dangerous to have someone skinning up an alpine slope. You could easily hike/ski the Tecumseh Trail up, summit Tecumseh and then hike over to the top of the resort slopes on the Sosman Trail and then ski down.
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  8. #8
    Senior Member mirabela's Avatar
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    You probably know that you still have three quarters of a mile to get to the summit from the top of the ski area, right? That section is not skiable, at least by us mere mortals.
    I hadn't gotten quite as far as figuring out "little details" like that yet, but thanks for pointing it out. I think I knew the top of the lifts was not the actual peak, but I didn't realize it was quite so long a schlep, or, as you say, not readily skiable. All helpful info. OK, snowshoes strapped to the pack, check. I'll call the area ...

  9. #9
    Moderator David Metsky's Avatar
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    I've hiked up and come down the ski slopes on foot. Ski patrol came over and I thought they would ask us to leave the slopes but he just asked which route we planned on taking down and asked that we stay over by the side.

    If you are skinning up (and I think they'll allow it) stay off to the side. There's no green route up the mountain so you'll be climbing relatively steep and moguled terrain. Valley Way to Oblivion might be the most direct route allowing you to avoid all trail crossings. But, as Audrey said, you still need to carry snowshoes for the final summit push, which may make the whole thing impractical.

    I suspect with short skis and a willingness to do some damage to your skins and edges you could make it to the summit on skis. The ski back out to the trails will be best if you keep the skins on since you really won't be able to go fast.
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  10. #10
    Senior Member MadRiver's Avatar
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    Since WV is National Forest they are very understanding about people hiking or skinning up their trails. As long as you yield to the skiers and stay as close to tree line as possible you should be ok. There are several ways to get to the top. David’s suggest of going up Valley Way to Oblivion is fine. However, Oblivion has a 90% turn about 200 yards from the top that can be very congested. You might want to take No Grit up instead. It is narrow, but not taken a lot by skiers. Once you reach the top of the trail stay to your left. Most skiers are heading to True Grit, Gema, or Ciao and they stay more to your right. Once you are past where the triple unloads, head to the Schwendi hutte. From there it is just a few hundred yards to the top.

    Another route would be to skin up the kiddy park (Pasture J-bar) to Lower Periphery to the Boneyard. The Boneyard is currently closed so you shouldn’t have any problems. Once at the top you will be level with the North Side chairlift. Ask the lift rat if Periphery is open. If it is closed take that to the top and stay to your right, especially where the trails forks. If open say away, it is way too narrow to avoid someone skinning up. Instead, take Tippecaneo and keep to your right. Once at the top of the trail you have two access trails on your right that will top out by the High Country chair. I would take the first one. Once at the chairlift, you are home free.

    Midweek would be your best time because the North Side and High Country chairs are not running. Also, check the trail status prior to arriving to see which trails are closed.
    Last edited by MadRiver; 01-05-2010 at 04:53 PM.
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  11. #11
    Senior Member DrewKnight's Avatar
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    I would agree with everything MadRiver said, but I wonder why you're not considering going up the Mt. Tecumseh Trail, then skiing down the ski area slopes? I do occasionally see people snowshoeing or skinning up, but as several people have suggested, doing so on closed trails will be a lot safer and less nerve-wracking for you.

    Further on MadRiver's note: they're blowing Periphery right now, so it will be open by the weekend. This is NOT a trail I would advise skinning up on a weekend day, as it is narrow and tends to draw a lot of novice skiers with questionable control. If you're determined to go up open ski trails, I would probably opt for Lower Meadows to Stillness to South Street to Oblivion, then No Grit as MadRiver mentions (but stay hard by the edge -- it's NARROW and is the major bail-out for novice skiers coming down from the top). Once you get above the Schwendi Hut, you're good for the dash up High Country (which is a wide open slope, but you can hug either edge if the chair is running). In general, this route is follows lesser-used trails with generally gentler grades. The Boneyard-Tippe route MadRiver suggests is more direct but also a lot steeper (not being a tele guy, I have no idea how steep is too steep).

  12. #12
    Poobah Emeritus darren's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadRiver View Post
    Since WV is National Forest they are very understanding about people hiking or skinning up their trails. As long as you yield to the skiers and stay as close to tree line as possible you should be ok.
    That is why they (and all the other ski areas that have leases on Natl Forest land) sell you a "lift ticket" and not a "ski pass". They can charge you to use their lift, but they can not charge you to use public land. At least that is what I recall from a discussion many moons ago.

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  13. #13
    Moderator bikehikeskifish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by darren View Post
    That is why they (and all the other ski areas that have leases on Natl Forest land) sell you a "lift ticket" and not a "ski pass". They can charge you to use their lift, but they can not charge you to use public land. At least that is what I recall from a discussion many moons ago.

    - darren
    One purchases a "ski pass" (or maybe it's technically a "trail pass") to XC ski on Waterville Valley's groomed XC trails on WMNF land. They cannot keep you off the WMNF access trails like Tripoli Road and Livermore Road. Last year and this (and maybe one year earlier) they stopped grooming Livermore all the way to the Depot camp and groom Deep Woods instead because they can charge you to ski there. Too many people, I assume, were doing laps on Livermore Road and not paying. Of course you can still do this by trudging out to the groomed area, or skiing Tripoli Road.

    Tim
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  14. #14
    Senior Member MadRiver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by darren View Post
    They can charge you to use their lift, but they can not charge you to use public land.
    - darren
    Exactly, so that is also why after WV closes for the season we have our annual Swiss Bob Party on the slopes with no worries that we will be kicked out.
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  15. #15
    Senior Member MichaelJ's Avatar
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    Someone with a little more time than I have right now should look up that discussion, because I thought the conclusion was that they have an executed lease with the WMNF, and so for the duration of ski season it's their property and they could certainly keep you out without a lift ticket/trail pass/post-it-note-from-mom if they wanted to. I recall some area even sold a nominal access ticket just for situations like this, so that you were bound by the indemnification and rules on the reverse of the ticket.
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