Allagash trip?

[coldfeet]

Was reading posts on other sites.....this sounds like a great trip....almost 100 miles in 7 -10 days......sounds like it can be made shorter.....kayak or only canoes?.....I'm going to start dreaming.....anyone care to share some info on this?....I'd love to try it....

 

[coldfeet]

Disregard the Allagash question.....I'm now concentrating on Old Forge in NY to start section paddling it....could take a very very long time, but one has to start somewhere...

 

[Fitz]

Kayaks

FWIW - there is a pretty strict definition of what is a "canoe" in the Allagash Regs. Some kayaks are not allowed. I was bummed out to learn that they don't allow sails/sailing canoes.

 

[Brambor]

i am uninformed

Is this a trip under some umbrella organization?

I thought the only restrictions in Maine were on power boats. As far as I knew you could float any Maine river in a giant pumpkin if you choose.

 

[IndianChris]

Is this a trip under some umbrella organization?

I thought the only restrictions in Maine were on power boats. As far as I knew you could float any Maine river in a giant pumpkin if you choose.

Yeah, good question.

 

[Fitz]

Allagash Waterway

Allagash Waterway Regulations.

http://www.maine.gov/doc/parks/programs/history/allagash/allagashrules.htm

A canoe is defined as a form of small watercraft long and narrow, sharp on both ends or sharp on one end and blunt at the other, usually propelled by paddles or small motors and having no sails. The width at the widest point shall not exceed 20% of the craft’s overall length, nor shall the transom, if any, exceed 26 inches in width. Measurement shall be the outside of the hull but shall not include gunwales, rub rails, or spray rails, if any.

I don't believe rudders are allowed either (one source I found says no, and other sources don't mention them).

http://www.maine.gov/doc/parks/programs/aww/awwcanoe.html


USE OF WATERCRAFT

A. From the south end of Telos Lake to the north end of Chamberlain Lake, the use of all models of personal watercraft (PWC), hovercraft, airboats, racing boats, and pontoon boats is prohibited.

B. From Lock Dam Stream, where it enters Eagle Lake north to Twin Brook Rapids, only canoes without motors or motors not exceeding 10 H.P., may be used on the watercourse.

C. On Allagash Lake and Allagash Stream to the red posts at the entrance of Chamberlain Lake, all watercraft are prohibited except canoes without motors.

D. Except on Telos and Chamberlain Lakes, the use of inflatable watercraft is prohibited.

E. Water skiing or other activities in which individuals are towed behind watercraft are prohibited .

 

[kasym]

Allagash Waterway Regulations.

I don't believe rudders are allowed either (one source I found says no, and other sources don't mention them).

I was up there last summer with two buddies. We all have 14' kayaks with rudders, and we hung out with one of the rangers near our boats for awhile. He had no issues with rudders. Sorry if you meant something else....

 

[Fitz]

Rudders

It may be worth a call. I suspect the rangers are showing some leeway, but according to Matt LaRoche, Superintendent of the Allagash Waterway, in an recent email:

When the legislature established the Allagash Wilderness Waterway in 1966 they defined a canoe as, “a form of small watercraft with no rudder or sails that is long and narrow, sharp on both ends or sharp on one end and blunt on the other end usually propelled by paddles or a small motor”. The Bureau of Parks & Lands further defined a canoe by rule.

The legislature by defining a canoe very specifically was being emphatic in protecting a certain type of experience in the Allagash. In that light, we do not allow sails on canoes, steering rudders, or other devices not specifically allowed by rule.

 

[Jay H]

What about a skeg? This is truly silly, if you ask me.

Jay

 

[sardog1]

What about the seam on a Grumman? (Sorry, I couldn't resist.)

Might be time for a new you-know-who video on the various follies of Maine's wilderness bureaucracies.

 

[sardog1]

Boats prohibited on the Allagash

You just knew someone was going to do this. A partial list of some Old Town boats, for example, that are apparently banned by the 20% beam to length rule:

Length in inches Actual width "Permitted" width
GUIDE 147 175 38 35
OSPREY 168 38.5 33.6
PACK 144 32 28.8
ROCKPORT 166 42 33.2

Note these are the published widths, not measured without gunwales as prescribed in the regulation. (Do the rangers carry giant micrometers for measuring hull width excluding gunwales?)

Call me when you put your Pack or Guide 147 in the water and the ranger wants to give you a citation. "I'll come runnin', wherever you are . . " with video camera in hand.

 

[Fitz]

Busted Kayak

oops:

Didn't make the criteria:

http://www.pressherald.com/news/Sol...40-mile-trip-in-Maine.html?searchterm=kayaker

 

[spider solo]

Guess that was her welcome to the Allagash.
Thought those guys would be busy organizing a dozen eggs or something.

Trying to find the specs for the 1st guy (Gil Whitney) to Kayak the entire trail. It might make an interesting comparison.
He was a retired trucker from Maine... seems to me he had a 14 ft kayak stuffed to the hilt.

...but I'll need to check the stats before I jump in with both feet...

 

[Stan]

The regulations say nothing about rudders but prohibit sails. They do not say anything about length, either, but state that the beam cannot exceed 20% of the length.

The 9' boat that was turned back, I surmise, must have exceeded 21.6" beam.

How absurd can regulations and their interpretation get?

 

[chinooktrail]

Does anyone know the REASONS behind the strict regulation that your kayak must be at least 12'? Is it for safety? Capacity? something else?

If this woman had paddled solo all that way already, I would imagine she had it pretty well dialed in as to what she needed and was comfortable with.

Kudos to Perception for providing her with a kayak to finish her amazing accomplishment!

 

[Stan]

Where is it written that it has to be 12'? That sounds rather arbitrary and it sounds like someone exceeded their authority unless either I've missed a new regulation (which requires hearings, which I'd likely not know about anyway) or they did the math on the beam requirement ... "Oh! your beam is 28.8 inches, you'll need at least a 12 foot boat."

 

[coldfeet]

Old Forge next week

Indian chris and I are going to Old Forge on 8/25 with 2 other people. Our plan is to paddle easily and get to the beginning of Long Lake by Saturday morning 8/28. If your around and want to join feel free!....pm me and I'll let you know where we are going to camp out.

 

[sardog1]

Okay, I gotta know, 'cuz I might just make a replica and engage in an overt act of civil disobedience next summer:

Anyone have the specs on Henry's boat when he did the Allagash?

EDIT: Found this in The Maine Woods -- Chesuncook: "At mid-afternoon we embarked on the Penobscot. Our birch was nineteen and a half feet long by two and a half at the widest part[.]" I.e., 12.8%. To which my wife replies upon hearing this: "Well, they may have done their research." Yeah, "they" may have. Still looking for the actual boat used on the "Allegash" (sic).

EDIT II: Yep, looks like "they" did their homework. From the same work, in "The Allegash and East Branch": "[W]e launched our canoe from a rock on the Moosehead Lake. . . . It was 18 1/4 feet long by 2 feet 6 1/2 inches wide in the middle[.]" I.e., 13.9%. Sigh.

 

[coldfeet]

Did it...

5 of us paddled from Old Forge to Long Lake. We travelled on water and foot for 46 miles over the 4 days...How some people do the 90 miles over 3 days or even 1 day is truly an amazing feat of strength and endurance....We had great weather and an amazing time....will get pics and report up during this week....the "carries" are hard if you don't have the proper boat....but I did get my 65lb poly 17ft touring kayak with 30 lbs of gear through....

Will hopefully continue this 10 year adventure in October...