Can someone please explain the WMNF Huts to me?

[paul ron]

I have hiked the WMNF in my younger years and have never used the huts nor have any need for em. I never had any desire to use "hotels" on the mountain as a backpacking experience, as well as hate the looks of em as I pass em on the trails.

I want to know who actually owns them? Are they private property?... owned by nonprofit organizations?... or are government run? Where do the fees go? who hires the people running them?

What confuses me is they are in the National Forest, in places where camping is restricted so how is a private business run in the National Forest imposing restrictions on the public, forcing them to use these hotels? I thought anything in a National Forest is public, on public land, and falls under public use guidelines. Do you have to reserve lean-tos in a National Forest as you do these huts? ...is it really to protect the land or is it a rich man's cash box in the sky with government cooperation?

 

[MadRiver]

Here is the short answer. The huts pre-date the “National Forest” designation and are therefore grandfathered in. They operate on a “Special Use Permit” given by the National Forest. They are owned by the AMC, who staff and maintain the huts. I’m certain others will chime in with more information.

 

[giggy]

http://www.outdoors.org/

http://www.randolphmountainclub.org/

AMC and RMC are the 2 most popular orgs that have them. RMC is way cheaper and open in winter - couple amc ones are open - but most aren't until may or something. I much prefer the the RMC ones.

 

[afka_bob]

...is it really to protect the land or is it a rich man's cash box in the sky with government cooperation?

Uh-oh, rich man, must be evil!!!

Google, comrade, and may the truth set you free!

 

[RoySwkr]

Here is the short answer. The huts pre-date the “National Forest” designation and are therefore grandfathered in. They operate on a “Special Use Permit” given by the National Forest. They are owned by the AMC, who staff and maintain the huts. I’m certain others will chime in with more information.

Slightly incorrect. The AMC actually owns an acre under Madison Hut. Lonesome Lake is in the state park not the NF. Some huts and extensions to all huts have been built since the NF acquired the land. The AMC has clout and can pretty much build what they want although they would be outraged if any other group did the same.

 

[Gris]

Now THERE is a loaded Q if i ever saw one!
PR, i predict you WILL get quite a response on this one.

IMHO the one GREAT thing about huts - and this has been said many times before - is it allows some folks (elder, younger, weaker, etc.) to get to places they wouldn't otherwise and thus share the experience in their own way.

BTW, isn't the CEO of the AMC also the CEO of LL Bean...?

 

[paul ron]

Oh no, I have no problems about them servicing people that normally wouldn't experiance the outdoors. Everyone is entitled to enjoy however they feel is right for them. I also have no problem with the Cog either. It may give me another chance to get to the top one day.

My question was why is there a business controlling the National Forest when it comes to making regulations where to camp? If it is a public park, there should be more public access to camping areas available to the general public such as free lean-tos and tent sites. Otherwise can I LNT camp anywhere as long as I am 200' off trail and away from water? Seems not, you are being forced to use pay as you go services provided by a vendor.

 

[kasym]

You are not required to stay in any of the AMC facilities. You can camp almost anywhere if you follow the WMNF regulations. http://www.fs.fed.us/r9/white/recreation/land_above/backcountry_rules.html

I have never stayed in any of the huts or in any of the tentsites when a caretaker was there, as I hike more in the winter, but I would like to try it out. I mostly stealth camp alot and have stayed at the tentsites in winter when there is no fee.

 

[SteveHiker]

I was always curious why Galehead hut has a wheelchair ramp. It just seems like a strange place for one. Has anyone ever used it?

 

[BrentD22]

WMNF is huge...

AMC = American Money Collectors

RMC = Cool people that love hiking!

 

[Paul Skelly]

If you trawl the internet or the bookstore a bit, you'll find lots of beta on the huts. Actually, I really like checking out the libraries within the AMC huts themselves... they are a priceless resource. A few months ago, I found a cool magazine from 1997 at one of the huts that had a picture of Alex Lowe on the cover. It made me think a little bit.

 

[kltilton]

I was always curious why Galehead hut has a wheelchair ramp. It just seems like a strange place for one. Has anyone ever used it?

From what I have heard the Galehead Hut is required to have a handicap ramp due to a lawsuit that sited the Americans with Disabilities Act. From what I heard some handicap guy hiked all the way to one of the huts, then complained that it wasn't handicap accessible. Just a rumor that I heard. The company I work for does all of the structural engineering for the AMC, so I'll see what I can find out.

 

[Barbarossa]

I was always curious why Galehead hut has a wheelchair ramp. It just seems like a strange place for one. Has anyone ever used it?

Galehead hut was renovated recently and the ramp was mandated by the Americans with Disabilities Act because the hut is on federal property.

There was a group of wheelchair "hikers" who made the trip up the Gale River trail in about 2001. I have read the story on the net. I will look for a link to post.

See links below:

http://www.ohcroo.com/galehead_trek.html

http://www.overlawyered.com/archives/000091.html

 

[BrentD22]

I remember that

I always thought that if I was handicap I would feel offended by the idea that I can find a way to make it all the way up the mountain on my wheel chair, but not be able to make it up some steps. I guess maybe some people view it as a "principle" kind of thing.

 

[Raymond]

I thought that ramp appeared to be blocked by a support post for the porch roof. Also, there's a narrow bridge well down the trail that has steps only, no ramp. Or so it was on September 14, 2000.

I see their hike was done about a month before mine.

 

[Stan]

Yes, the huts are more expensive than tents and leantos but I don't think they aren't competitive with base costs in the valley plus meals when you consider the location. I've enjoyed them in my mix of hiking accomodations and met some long lasting friendships there.

Smelling another potential rant against accessibility (maybe I still got my Mountains and Molehills antenna up) I'd just like to point out that Galehead Hut was required to be accessible by regulation, trails are not. Massachusetts, like other state and federal parks, has built some accessible trails that I've observed get lots of use.

I don't understand the troglodytical attitude of some towards accessibility features. Ramps are more efficient than stairs, safer in winter, and easier to build (ever cut stringers?). Door handles are easier for everyone to use than knobs. Additional turnaround area (for wheelchairs) is welcome space by all. And wheelchair space below counters and tables doesn't hamper my enjoyment of a place. So put up your dukes if you're even thinking of bashing accessibility!

 

[Mike P.]

Galehead, not so much because someone complained but as a new building built on Federal Land, it must meet federal req's. Not only the ramp but easier to use door handles for people without fingers or prosthetic hands & wider stalls.

While much will be made about the hotels in the sky & the private club, the majority of trails in the whites are cleared & maintained by the AMC, the USFS does not have the manpower or funding to do the job.

 

[SteveHiker]

Stan,

I was just curious. I wasn't saying there was anything wrong with it. It seemed weird to me that it would be there after climbing all those stone stairs on the Gale River Trail. Plus I don't remember seeing a handicapped space at the trailhead.

Seriously though, that was a great story that Barbarossa posted. I'm glad they were able to do it. I have a niece that has CP and is in a wheelchair. Just taking her to the mall is a lot of work. I can't begin to imagine taking her up there.

 

[Stan]

Steve, I really hadn't singled you out by my comments. Just that I still smart from the insensitivities that went through a couple threads back at Mountains and Molehills when discussions of Galehead accessibility came up.

As a builder I also know the comparative costs and it ain't really that bad when you consider the safety and convenience it lends to all of us. A major cost delta at Galehead was that they forgot to design it in the first time and had to literally go back to the drawing board.

Ironically, Galehead is probably the least "accessible" in getting there of all the huts.

 

[RoySwkr]

Galehead, not so much because someone complained but as a new building built on Federal Land, it must meet federal req's. Not only the ramp but easier to use door handles for people without fingers or prosthetic hands & wider stalls.

There are also wider doors on some bunkrooms and on the crew's quarters (I asked).

Note that all huts are accessible by helicopter. Since the AMC insists that flights are necessary for supplies, someday an activist will file a crew application and say they can commute by chopper. Or a potential guest will request chopoer access, and then insist the Forest Service should pay as a "reasonable accommodation."