Just when is it to windy to try a summit?

[Couchybar]

My biggest judgment calls often involve the discision to 'brave' high winds above
tree line to reach a summit. My concern is not cold injuries, I have clothing for that.
My fear are more basic, that of either being blown off the mountain or being
knocked down and away with sufficient force to be injured. Has anyone turned
back for just that reason?.
Weight, profile and surface steepness and conditions all come into play, but at what
speeds is it simply too dangerous to go on?

 

[SherpaKroto]

My rule of thumb: when I start getting knocked over, it's time to turn around. I'm not talking about getting blown around, I'm talking about faceplants caused by the wind.

Visibility also comes into play. I am more cautious as the visibility lessens. I'm more apt to push the envelope a bit when I can see 50+ miles

 

[carole]

Interestingly, the first time I turned back because of wind alone was this month (Sat. 13th). We knew wind, as well as visibility, would be a determining factor as we began the hike. We were on Airline and all was fine in the woods. We geared up as we approached Knife’s Edge. We had some good gusts along there but visibility was still good and we made it to the junction for the cut-off to Madison hut with little difficulty. We now had .8 to summit Adams. We agreed to continue. Only a couple dozen steps changed that as the wind was now a constant roar (hurricane force) out of the ravine and neither of us could stand upright nor could we even hear each other though shouting into the ear. Hand signals spoke our agreement to turn around. Even turning around became a circus and it was almost a crawl back to the sign. What a difference a few yards make. We had no desire to crawl to the summit and so cut across to the hut where we met others hoping to head to Adams. Though still quite windy at the hut (enough that we decided to wait until we began descending to have a break) we warned the others what was ahead. Some detours along the water course off Valley Way made for a nice end-of-winter hike while reminded of the impressive force of the wind.

 

[Rick]

Shouldn't this thread be more aptly titled -

At what point do you retreat from your attempt??

it's too windy for me when I can lean more than 45 degrees - That's why I always carry my Silva Ranger Compass with the built in clinometer

 

[LittleBear]

A couple of winters ago, I was attempting Lafayette. It was pretty cold (minus 10 or so at the hut) and windy. We estimated the winds to be around 40+ mph. They were coming from the west. We decided to try for the summit. With the wind behind us, it wasn't too bad, but it was getting colder and I was getting more uncomfortable (I have trouble keeping my fingers warm). About 1/3 mile from the hut we decided to turn around. I would have loved to have made it to the top, but we knew that coming down the wind would be full force in our faces. It was tough enough just dealing with the wind for 1/3 mile. There were lots of people who actually hiked up Falling Waters, across the ridge and down that day, but I was very happy to turn around.

When we got back to the car, I had an interesting experience as I tried to remove my jacket - seems it had frozen on the inside to my fleece!

 

[Willie]

Time to turn around ...

I turn around either when: (1) I'm not having fun any longer, or (2) that little voice in my head tells me to turn back.

 

[Mark]

Some excellent advice has been offered here. I'll add a few comments. While I am a conservative hiker and always prepared to turn back, sometimes the conditions are acceptable for a windy summit attempt. Case in point: Wright Peak in the 'daks last October. When my brother and I got to tree line, we were blasted with sustained 40+ MPH winds. We evaluated the conditions. The temperatures were around freezing, perhaps a little above so there was little risk of frostbite. We were ascending into the wind, so it would be at our back on the return. The summit was only a couple hundred meters away over relatively clean rock with good footing and good trail markings. Visibility was very good. There was no blowing snow or rime ice. Probably the most important two factors were that there was no sharp drop off down wind in case we got blown over and we were both prepared to turn around at any point.

We dropped our packs in a safe place. We also stashed our poles. While I almost never hike without them, hikers before us told us they had to crawl the last few meters to the summit on all fours. Poles would not have helped in this situation and would have become a danger in the high wind gusts. Staying low in the wind and dropping to all fours during the strong gusts kept us low to the ground and made it less likely we would get blown away.

We did end up having to scramble on all fours to the top of the summit cone where we estimated the winds to be 50-70 MPH. We could not stand up and it was difficult to breath at times. We only stayed a few minutes before carefully making our way back down to our packs. It was quite exhilarating.

Had any of the conditions been different, we would have probably turned around. If the footing was poor, or the temperature lower, or if it wasn’t such a flat summit, it would not have been worth the attempt. Having gotten reports from earlier hikers who made the summit also helped, but one always has to take into account the accuracy of such reports.

 

[Jim lombard]

I turned back on Mt Monroe about 100 feet vertically from the summit after being knocked to my knees for the fourth time. 70mph gusts did the trick on that day.

 

[Bhoody]

crawling

I think when you find yourself crawling its time to turn back. I've heard of people crawling to summits - no way - the fact that you can't stand upright is a bad thing...

 

[jfb]

I turn back if the wind is strong enough that I may get blown off-balance between steps as I walk, probably about 50 or 60 mph. At that point the risk of falling down and getting injured is too great, and getting injured is not on my "to-do" list. Of course if the wind increases on the way down, I just try to be careful.

 

[Mark]

One other factor is the consistency of the wind speed. The wind speed on my Wright summit was pretty consistent with occasional gusts.

I think it is easier to walk in consistent 50 MPH winds than in 40 MPH winds gusting to 60.

 

[woodstrider]

When is it too windy?

You must always be willing to accept responsibility for the decisions you make for yourself and/or others. Your life will depend on your own good judgement.

I always turn around when it becomes too difficult to keep going forward, comfortably (a relative term).

I always make decisions to go forward-or not, based on the weakest member of the group. And, I never split up the group.

I keep in mind that I must also save some juice for the return trip.

I remain humble in the presence of forces outside my control.

I remember that the mountain will always be there.

Cheers

 

[stoopid]

One other factor is the consistency of the wind speed. The wind speed on my Wright summit was pretty consistent with occasional gusts.

I think it is easier to walk in consistent 50 MPH winds than in 40 MPH winds gusting to 60.

That's a good point.

I think I saw my limit on Marcy last weekend. 60mph or so is about all I could justify, and it was a pretty steady wind so I managed pretty well considering mother nature wanted me OFF the mountain, and in a HURRY!

But there's a part of my with Rick -- I'd risk more than I will probably admit here after hiking miles and climbing thousands of feet for that last couple hundred yards if need be...

 

[Peakbagr]

I have crawled to the top of Wright Pk more than once, each time in the winter.
Once on Marcy in January, the visibility was 5', and the wind was so strong and loud that shouting could barely be heard when right next to my partners. The stronger gusts tried to pick us up, with the crampons and ice axe providing the anchor points.
One September 4 of us did a traverse of the Presidentials. The portion from Lakes to Madison was a day we'll always remember...
Temp hovered around 32 all day, frozen fog and rime ice everwhere, very high winds and almost zero visibility.
The next day we read that the wind was a steady 50 to 70mph with higher gusts.
The key to all of this: be in good shape, carry and know how to use a map & compass and have the bearings to and from every feature taped to the back of the compass, have the proper equipment and clothing, and a strong party so you can back each other up.

 

[Reekee]

relative wind

On my very first high peak, which was Marcy, I got knocked down 3 times by the wind but it was the zero visibility that turned me around. By the time I got to the LOJ parking lot I was hooked. Before climbing Mts. I was a skydiver for 10 years. When you're not anchored to anything the wind is your friend as is true in sailing. I love the wind. The stronger the better but very chicken when the visibility drops. So there in is my rule. If you're driving down interstate 84 and see a guy with his head out the window with a silly grin on his face, it's probably me. Enjoy, Reekee

 

[BrentD22]

Another important thing to remember is in which direction is the wind blowing?

I learned this lesson this past winter. After sleeping at Gray Knob night 1, I made a summit attempt of Mt. Adams. It was really grey out with high winds. It started off with blowing loose snow. Later it turned to blowing sleet. The wind was at my back the way up (basiclly). After getting to the base (when I say the base I mean the area after Thunderstorm Junction) of Mt. Adams and the visibility was so low (and getting worst) that I could not see the next carin I decided to turn around. I then relized I could not see anything because the heavy sleet was blowing directly in my face now. I was like driving in a car with really bad windsheld wipers. Goggles on I could not see, goggles off the sleet stung my eyes. I never thought about what the wind would feel like on the way down!

 

[rhihn]

There are two hikes we have done that come immediately to mind in regard to wind -- Wright Peak and Goose Eye. Both TRIPS were great, but neither peak was much fun, due to the wind. On Wright we quite literally crawled to the summit(as Peakbagr mentioned). On Goose Eye the gusts were intermittent but quite powerful, and we spent little time on top (we were on our way to Mahoosuc Notch anyway). The remainder of both trips were relatively wind-free, and there was no forecast for either trip that offered any indication of what we might encounter on top.

 

[Couchybar]

Thanks for all who contributed to this thread. Your comments have been quite
illuminating and instructive. They have spanned the range of my limited experience
and have been extended my thinking to situations that I have never fully anticipated.

Kevin you are absolutely right in the your comments concerning the critical nature of
clothing, especially above tree line. My comment was not meant to de-emphasize this
importance but was intended to focus the question more on the mechanical and physical implications of
high wind.

My first winter trip in the ADKs was a late February day hike up Wright. It was -18
when I left the Lodge at 12.30 p.m. then my zip pull thermometers bottomed out at
-20 on the trail. The wind was excitingly strong above tree line. On the way up it
was coming in off my right side. I thought that I was fully covered. I summated and
quickly turned around ,clockwise, to start heading down. In the second it took to
turn through the wind it found a small gap between my glacier glasses, my face mask
and balaclava. The skin flash froze. There was no pain when it froze, it did not hurt
when it blistered then dried nor when when the negrosis fell out. I sported a small dent, then a scar on my face for nearly a year.
I learned few thing that day.

 

[Skiddah]

There are two hikes we have done that come immediately to mind in regard to wind -- Wright Peak and Goose Eye. ---

Rhihn, You make an interesting point, at least for me. The only signifigant wind I have encountered in my limited hiking experience has been the three times I have summited Goose Eye. Each hike was quite different, but in each case the wind gusts caused us to hustle off the peak.

Of course, Goose Eye and the Wright trail have been my nemesis since 1990. The three times I have hiked that mountain I ended up bushwhacking for some stretch.

Oh well, we have always made it to where we intended and the wind was never enough to turn us back.