Winter 46er list

[mavs00]

Well said Brad............

I actually posted the Lewey info looking for other winter hikers. cuz bottom line was, I was't totally comfortable bushwhacking a rarely climbed remote (no trail) ADK100 Highest solo in winter. and couldn't get any of my usual partners to go.

The fact that someone used our tracks a few days later was totally cool with me.

Why I am more careful about what I post is more a result that there are a remote few that don't want you to know that Lewey exists or that you can climb it and they thumb their nose at you for posting that type of info. In the past, I've shared pics of places or TRs and have gotten less than flattering responses. Not that any of this has anything to do with winter hiking but........... You asked.

Generally, I'll share stuff, maybe not everything but I things like open routes in winter, for sure.

 

[MLepore]

In the winter I have learned that you give some and get some. Most times, if I have planned a winter climb, I will go no matter if the trail is broken or not. Sometimes the trail is broken out, but sometimes its not. Personally, I find a greater sense of satisfaction at the end of the end breaking the trail.
If someone follow the trail I recently broke that's fine. As you can see by the number of posts I don't always log all my trips. Mavs I agree with you as far as posting information on less remote peaks.

 

[Pete_Hickey]

Most times, if I have planned a winter climb, I will go no matter if the trail is broken or not. Sometimes the trail is broken out, but sometimes its not.

I was the same way when I did my winter 46. That's why it took me 10 years or so. That's why I didn't get Marshal until my fifth attempt, Gothics on my fourth, etc. Most of them were solo, and I enjoyed the climbs, even if I didn't reach the summit. I kind of liked breaking trail alone, because I could turn back when I wanted if I got tired. Nobody to pressure me into getting the peak.

 

[Tom Rankin]

So everyone who has climbed a mountain after the first person did- who had no trail, no physiological assurance that it could be done is stealing it?

Where's the line drawn? I've climbed a mountain by following a trail, did I steal it because I didn't blaze my own trail? I certainlly had a cake walk as compared to the first explorer who went that way...

If you really feel this strongly about this, do you make the effort to choose your own route and bushwack every mountain from the trailhead?

This is why I stopped complaining about the 4 (actually there are more) peaks in the DAX that "don't count". I reasoned that if those that had gone before me could climb them (most likely under much worse circumstances), then so could I!

BTW, Warren, there is at least one person who has bushwhacked all 46 of the DAX. I'm not exactly sure what this means, but so I have heard...

 

[Neil]

I was the same way when I did my winter 46. That's why it took me 10 years or so.

Hey mon, you poor guy. You born too soon! Now we've got the 46 wired mon. Read the forums mon and go with the flow. Deep snow? Ouach! Today's winter hiker wears ultra lite shoes mon and follows the hard core primitives. Champagne for the 46th? Gangha baby, gangha.

 

[Skyclimber]

BTW, Warren, there is at least one person who has bushwhacked all 46 of the DAX. I'm not exactly sure what this means, but so I have heard...

His name is John Winkler, 46er B-1
It means that he ascended all 46 peaks by bushwhack route. He did not use the aid of a trail or herdpath. He did descend the trail on the way down.

 

[Pete_Hickey]

If you really feel this strongly about this, do you make the effort to choose your own route and bushwack every mountain from the trailhead?

I think you have it backwards. It isn't to make it harder for yourself, it's to make it harder for others.

To some people, seeing others get their winter46 rocker by always following broken trails, lessesn the value of their own. Going back rather far, when Ed Bean, Guy Waterman, Fred Hunt, etc got theirs, it was a REAL challenge. So one of those guys tells someone they climbed the winter 46, that someone says, 'so what? Lots of people do it.'

 

[Neil]

This discussion keeps popping up. If someone feels that their achievement is devalued because someone else gets the same "credit" for way less work, chutz-pah, balls or whatever, then that means that their achievement's worth is related not to their own inner sense of value but to what others think about it. Who cares about the others? You know what you did, what it means, how tough it was etc. The rocker is a common symbol of a highly uncommon and personal achievement.

 

[Skyclimber]

I think you have it backwards. It isn't to make it harder for yourself, it's to make it harder for others.

To some people, seeing others get their winter46 rocker by always following broken trails, lessesn the value of their own. Going back rather far, when Ed Bean, Guy Waterman, Fred Hunt, etc got theirs, it was a REAL challenge. So one of those guys tells someone they climbed the winter 46, that someone says, 'so what? Lots of people do it.'

Praise God! Someone knows what I am talking about! Thanks Pete!
Even though I don't go quite back with Fred Hunt and those guys, it wasn't easy, it wasn't easy!

 

[Peakbagr]

Pete and Marta....exactly.

 

[mavs00]

I wonder if ole' George, Bob & Herbie look down on all of us and say that very same thing.

Not much you can do except take pride in what YOU have done. For me, I won't take any less pride when I look at my 46r patch, even knowing my 11 y/o daughter was able to do the same frigging thing. Congrats on ALL you "w" finishers and take justifed pride in how you got there. Hell, you don't get w+ on your rocker cuz just you broke every trail along the way now do ya.

If it makes you feel better, I got lots of respect to all of you guys that have taken the "w" journey, even those of you who stole one or two along the way

 

[Grumpy]

This discussion keeps popping up. If someone feels that their achievement is devalued because someone else gets the same "credit" for way less work, chutz-pah, balls or whatever, then that means that their achievement's worth is related not to their own inner sense of value but to what others think about it. Who cares about the others? You know what you did, what it means, how tough it was etc. The rocker is a common symbol of a highly uncommon and personal achievement.

Neil, I think you tagged the nail right on the head here, and said it all very directly and succinctly.

Now . . .

Without wishing to disparage anyone, another comment from this discussion very nicely summed up what makes my skin crawl:

. . . It isn't to make it harder for yourself, it's to make it harder for others.

To some people, seeing others get their winter46 rocker by always following broken trails, lessens the value of their own. . . .

That conveys an attitude quite contrary to the customarily generous nature of most hikers and mountain people I’ve met over 50-plus years of tramping around in the boonies. The idea that making something harder for others preserves or heightens the value of one’s own accomplishment is just beyond my ken. I always thought the greater glory was to be gained by being of good will and service to others, not by hindering them. But to each his own, I guess.

G.

 

[Pete_Hickey]

The idea that making something harder for others preserves or heightens the value of one’s own accomplishment is just beyond my ken. I always thought the greater glory was to be gained by being of good will and service to others, not by hindering them. But to each his own, I guess.

Not necessarily harder, just not easier. Suppose that the club would give out patches either to someone who climbed the 46, OR to someone who donated more than, say, $5,000 to some environmental cause. Would that make you feel like your patch is worth less? Suppose they simply sold them at the Mountaineer, and anyone could buy them. Would that make a difference?

Taking it into a different world things DO make a difference. I got my university degree through 4 years of hard work. There are companies (read your spam) that will sell you uniiversity degrees for only $49.00. Can these lessen the value of something.

FWIW, it doesn'T bother me one way or the other. I climbed the way I wanted to, and my winter rocker is still on the top of the refridgerator, where it has been for years.

But I do understand how some others feel.

 

[Pete_Hickey]

I wonder if ole' George, Bob & Herbie look down on all of us and say that very same thing.

You do realize that some peaks were easier for them than they are these days. In particular, the Sewards. Before the 50's hurricaine the forests were very open, and there were logging roads leading close to the summits.

 

[mavs00]

You do realize that some peaks were easier for them than they are these days. In particular, the Sewards. Before the 50's hurricaine the forests were very open, and there were logging roads leading close to the summits.

Yes, Street and Nye were covered with open "cinderella forest" too. I know all that, You get my point, Becoming a 46er in the 2000's (or even 80's & 90's) is different then it was becoming one in the 1920's, I hope we agree there.

For instance, most modern day hikers at least drive to the LOJ to start hikes, those dudes used to walk

 

[Reekee]

Mike, My number on your site is 280 and it's 279 on the 46er site. Which is correct? Thanks Reekee

 

[mike1889]

Mike, My number on your site is 280 and it's 279 on the 46er site. Which is correct? Thanks Reekee

280 is correct. I haven't sent the updated list to the 46er Webmaster to update the web page yet, will do that shortly. There was one finisher who finished in 2001 who just reported her climbs, and that bumped everyone who finished after her up one number. The numbers for Winter 46ers aren't official, like the numbers for regular 46ers are. So if someone reports late, they are put in the correct chronological location and the numbers are increased. I just updated the list on the first post to include 2 new Winter 46ers who just reported, #308 and #311.

 

[Reekee]

Thanks

So my 46er number is not subject to change. That is good news because I have a really neat number. It's 5344. Does that number ring a bell? Thanks again Mike. Reekee

 

[Tom Rankin]

So my 46er number is not subject to change. That is good news because I have a really neat number. It's 5344. Does that number ring a bell? Thanks again Mike. Reekee

Gee I like my number too! And a friend of mine is 4445.

Can you tell I'm fascinated with numbers?

 

[Cloudsplitter]

Everest, anyone?

To me the arguments presented in this thread are common debates that extend across all of outdoor sport. Think of the neverending debates in mountaineering communities about the "correct" ways to scale some of the world's highest peaks...Oxygen or no oxygen? Sherpas or no sherpas? Fixed routes or alpine style? The debates will probably go on forever. I'll grant that we are certainly talking about things on a very different level here, but the core issue is the same: What exactly places value on or devalues someone's outdoor achievements? Along those lines let me pose a question to those of you who are talking about "stealing" summits and feeling your accomplishments lessened by the acts of others...Would any of you, upon summiting an 8000 meter peak, feel a surge of disappointment at the fact that you relied on sherpas to help you reach the summit?? I think not. In such things we often become so wrapped up in the behaviors of those around us that we cheat ourselves out of enjoyable experiences.
-C