Baxter Use Dropping?

[ChrisB]

I just got my Friends of Baxter Park winter 2005 newsletter. It contains an article that claims that Park use has been dropping over the past 10 years and is presently off 20% as compared to 1995.

The metrics used were overall Visitors, Visitor Days, and Camper nights. Visitors dropped from 83k in 1995 to 63.5k in 2004. Camper Nights from 69.5k in 1995 to 56k in 2004.

The Authority interprets this as a positive since it takes pressure off facilities and trails.

Buzz C is quoted as attributing the drop off to crowding on the mountain, long waiting lines at the gates and the early planning process required. He also believes the drop off will not change the "Wilder Within" course he has set for the Park.

Interesting trends...

cb

 

[lumberzac]

I wish the same would happen in the Adirondack High Peaks. The human impact on that area is horrible.

 

[Tramper Al]

Numbers game

So, correct me if I am wrong.

The park's 'capacity' is set as a matter of policy, yes? I mean BSP allows a certain number of campers per night and then a certain number of dayhiker cars per day, and that's that. I don't know if the capacities have been changed over the last ten years or not. Certainly the park is 'full' on several days over the summer particularly, right? A true decline in numbers may indicate that more (week)days are not reaching capacity, or that we are getting less good at carpooling - filling the lots with fewer hikers.

As for the long lines at the gate and the 'early planning process', those are just a function of BSP regs and policies, I assume within their control to make more or less onerous for the visitor, thus discouraging or encouraging use.

I'm not convinced that less interest in Baxter the park would be in the best long term interest of Baxter the place.

 

[bobmak]

I'm not convinced that less interest in Baxter the park would be in the best long term interest of Baxter the place.

I think less interest in the way of usage is a good thing. The Whites are used to death. Obviously there are many factors contributing to this, such as close proximity to Boston. But compared to when I started hiking in 78 or so, the increase has between tremondous. I see as many people now on some trails in the winter as I used to see to see in the summer. The "hidden" or hard to get places that I used to hike to are now all well known and well used spots. I am not whining, just stating a fact. When I go to Baxter, I stay away from Katahdin just because of the crowds; the same reason I stay away from most of the high peaks in the Whites, especially in the nicer weather. It's a nice thing having a trail to oneself for a few days. What makes Baxter so appealing is lack of crowds; even less crowds makes it even more appealing.

My $.02.... others opinions most welcome!

 

[Papa Bear]

I'm not convinced that less interest in Baxter the park would be in the best long term interest of Baxter the place.

OK, I'll take the bait.

In my self-conciously elitist opinion, I am convinced that zero interest in Baxter the park would be in the very best interest of Baxter the place.

Pb

 

[arghman]

<begin tangent>
can anyone confirm/update the following:

I heard Buzz the park director at a dinner a few years ago (very good speaker!!!). At the time he mentioned they were planning on moving the parking access at Roaring Brook campground a mile or two further south, to help relieve the overuse.

Is this true? I was kind of hoping it wasn't -- I'd like to make it to the top of Baxter Peak (made it to Pamola peak in '94 via the Helon Taylor trail), but my knees/ankles don't always work well on >10 mile hikes.
<end tangent>

I am in favor of the early planning process, I do think people who plan ahead should get priority over spur-of-the-moment-ers in accessing fragile natural resources; it doesn't seem like too big a hurdle & if it helps protect BSP that's a good thing. (I mean geez, you usually have to make reservations at hotels, and nobody minds!!!!!)

 

[Mad Townie]

Yeah, Buzz thinks use is dropping due to overcrowding.

Don't get me started, I'm usually a very positive guy who volunteers at the Park. Nadine, Twigeater, either of you want to take the bait??? On second thought, let's just drop it.

 

[forestgnome]

IMO, dropping enjoyment of Baxter is by design. It's easier to cross the Mexican border than to enter the Royal Realm of Baxter. You may see few signs of human presence in many parts of Baxter, but I get an unwelcome feeling no matter where I am in that place, which is exactly what they want. Fine with me! I'll take the WMNF any day. I know countless places to enjoy where I feel completely alone in the forest, and I don't feel a bit unwelcome.
I'm glad there is such a place as Baxter, but they can keep it. I love the WMNF just the way it is.

 

[SherpaKroto]

Funny, my pattern is just the opposite. Every time I go to BSP, I can't wait to get back. I'm not overly fond of the rules and regulations, but find that anything truly worth having is worth working for. I much prefer being in an area where I know most have worked to get to, than chancing that my leanto partners won't ruin my trip by being total morons. I love the fact that I can hike at my own pace, reaching my accomodations when I feel like getting there, with nothing to rush me. That allows me to have some last minute side trips that have been memorable (Doubletop comes to mind). Without the regs, a N>S Ski traverse trip like Spencer planned would be foolhardy (for me, anyway). With them, we know that we have a warm place to stay, and someone will know where we are for the whole trip.

As for feeling unwelcome, I've never had that happen, and I've been there 7-8 times now. I have been chastised once for what Mary Ellen felt was bending the rules (it wasn't). On the other hand, I've found the staff to be extremely helpful in suggesting alternatives when things were booked. In the Park, I have NEVER been treated in anything but a welcome manner. The Park Rangers are some of the best I've had the pleasure to meet anywhere, and I always take the opportunity to sit and chat with them whenever I'm up there.

I guess I'm just saying that I love BSP, and I'll keep going there until I can't. (FWIW, I'm headed there 2/3 for 5 days, 2/14 for 6 more, and 6/? for 4 more, so you might say I'm biased )

 

[Waumbek]

BSP Opening Day

I'm at Acadia attempting to return to NH tomorrow. I attended the BSP "Opening Day" extreme reservation event in Millinocket on Tuesay for the first time ever this year, more about which later. For whatever it's worth. the headcount of those of us crazy enough to stand in line at -15*F was a mere 50 +/_. (I did it for the experience, which was fascinating, not the reservation per se.) They say this was a big drop from the 200 or so people who have been out there in the cold waiting for reservations in the past. Whether this reflects the temporary change in the 2005 trial system (only 20% given out on opening day) or a larger trend nobody knows yet. Buzz handed out hot coffee and donuts (which flash froze if you didn't eat them quickly). Very nice guy.

 

[Nadine]

My two cents...

I like it the way it is. I've never had problems getting in on any day I've wanted to hike, but then I don't just hike the big K. I enjoy the solitude of the Pogy Notch, Russel Pond, Wassataquoik, and have hiked for days and never seen a soul. Since I have more days off midweek than weekends, the park suits my needs. I've spent the night in a lean-to in the middle of July at Chimney Pond and not had issues getting short notice reservation...

The winter regs are a bit intense, and I wish the park stayed open during spring skiing season, but overall, I'm content with the ways things are run.

 

[twigeater]

I read that in the newsletter as well. At first I thought the new reservation system would increase use in the park - then when I think about how my friends who are "dying to go" into the park can't commit a week in advance - I don't worry about it. To me it's always been worth planning a year ahead of time.

Exactly which regs does everyone hate?
Compare the majority of the regs with LNT and there are no differences.
Is it the no radios, no cellphones, no dogs? Or is it the reservation regulations? To me the regs just enforce respect for other hikers/campers.

I also enjoy the take your time-hike all day to get to your site freedom I have in BSP. I read about the rush to get sites in the White's and it turns me off. Knowing there's a lean-to or other site waiting for you and only your party will be in it, is very nice. And like Nadine, I'm not always at BigK. There's so much beauty in other parts of the park, and even plenty of solitude on Katahdin if you hike away from Baxter peak. Closing the road to Roaring Brook around the Windey Pitch is in Buzz's Wilder Within plan. Among other things, Sandy Stream Pond is becoming a real headache to manage.

I did think the winter regs had been relaxed somewhat - instead of the standard 4 person party, only three are required at roadside sites, 4 above treeline. Before I found other souls willing to brave BSP in winter, I'd read the regs and think you practically had to have a doctor in the group to go in.

 

[spencer]

Here's what I have to say...

 

[twigeater]

LOL!

I agree spencer!

Even when I was emptying mousetraps and re setting them in the Nesowadnehunk bunkhouse a week or so ago, I was having a GREAT time!

 

[funkyfreddy]

I also love Baxter State Park just the way it is. I'm glad it's not over run with BS like so much of the Whites....... and it's very important to me living in a place like NYC to know there is still a place like Baxter left in the northeast!

No huts, no railroads, no strip malls, no auto roads to mountaintop cafeterias............. aaah yes, almost like wilderness, isn't it?

 

[Artex]

I think overused areas like the high peaks region in the 'Dacks could learn something from Baxter's policies. And let the numbers drop, it just means more of the park for me.

 

[MikePS]

I have had the opportunity to get to BSP for at least some time, every year for the past twenty years. Summer-Fall only, no winter. I have also spent many hours in the Whites. There is no doubt that Baxter is well managed and provides an experience unattainable elsewhere in the North east. I have found the staff, rangers-with one notable exception in 20 years, to be friendly and helpful. Considering the fact that they deal at times with people clueless about wilderness behavior, I am amazed at the patience they show. The park is a gift, where yopu can find adventure and solitude especially away from the big peak. I must say that I am surprised at reduced numbers- in fact I would have guessed the opposite. Many areas have seen improvements, especially the road north from Kt. Stream to So. Branch.I will be curious to see how the new system impacts things-

 

[Brambor]

BSP - good

I go to BSP once per year. I never make reservations. I show up at the gate very early in order to get a day use permit and I'm ready to be refused - in which case I head up Golden Road to another location. When I get to the gate I ask what they have open and available. I take the best from what they have to offer. Then I talk to the ranger at the trailheads/campgrounds from which I hike. When they find out I'm seasoned backpacker (wink wink) they loosen up and in most cases they will check for availability and cancellations. I have been going to BSP since 1988 and only was refused for overnight only once.

 

[vegematic]

Ditto what Twigeater, Spencer and others have said. While making reservations months in advance requires some commitment and maybe even a little inconvenience I find that the rules and regs serve to improve my overall experience. I have never felt unwelcome or hassled by rangers and while the rules certainly don't eliminate the cell phones and the large, inconsiderate groups I find such problems to be considerably reduced. I appreciate that the park is trying to be more "forever wild" and less "forever growing and expanding", and I think it's quite a bargain for the money.
-vegematic

 

[Stan]

But Twigeater! Trapping is against the rules at Baxter Park (rule 22, maybe 15, too)! I find the traps make great kindling and am conviced that it's easier to adapt to mice than it is to extirpate them from the Park. hmmm, isn't that part of the ethic?

I, too, love Baxter Park and have never found that the regulations prevented me from full enjoyment of the place. And, I've always found the staff to be couteous, helpful and knowledgeable.